Edison Brown Wax Concert & Columbia Grand Cylinder Woes

[FellowCollector]

I'm wondering if anyone here has found a good solution for reaming brown wax Edison Concert cylinders and Columbia Grand cylinders.

I'll be doggoned if I can figure out what to do. For many years I've not been able to play some of my Edison Concert and Columbia Grand cylinders because they have shrunk and will not completely seat enough on the mandrel to allow the gate to close!

I WISH that someone would make a Concert size reamer for these cylinders! I have tried applying sandpaper on my mandrel and allowing it to spin while holding the cylinder and this proves to be awkward and precarious at best. I have tried carefully hand sanding the inside core on a shrunken test brown wax Concert cylinder and inevitably the cylinder becomes slightly out of round!

Does anyone here know of any good method to ream these wonderful cylinders safely so that they can fit properly on the mandrel and not be out of round?

Thanks, in advance, for any help.

Doug

[ChuckA]

I'm wondering if anyone here has found a good solution for reaming brown wax Edison Concert cylinders and Columbia Grand cylinders.
....
Thanks, in advance, for any help.
Doug

Doug,
Same problem here, I tried reaming out one but as soon as I had to go down to the point of removing the ridges to make it fit, the record would not stay tight
on the mandrel. I think the problem is the ridges act like a suction cup and keep the record tight. I haven't got back to the problem for awhile but I've thought
about using a cloth tape I use for making wiring harnesses. It's very thin and has excellent adhesion to anything. I'm thinking that two bands on the mandrel
one on each end where the record contacts the mandrel might give the needed friction.
The stuff worked good to fix a wobbly concert mandrel on my Edison Duplex.

When I get the my past due jobs off the bench I'll try it again.

Chuck

[FellowCollector]

Hi Chuck,
Thanks so much for your input! I'm curious how you reamed your cylinder. I'm still at the point of finding a method to ream a Concert size cylinder that will remove some of the wax core evenly on all sides so that it is not out of round during rotation after reaming. It sounds like you were able to ream a Concert size cylinder but possibly a little more of the internal ridge material was removed than you desired and the cylinder will no longer seat onto the mandrel and stay put.

Most of my troublesome Concert size cylinders are somewhat close to allowing the end gate to close but not quite. I'm thinking I need to remove just a little core ridge wax to make them fit. But I'm stumped on how to remove the internal core wax evenly. I'm thinking...remove a little bit of core wax and try the fit...ughhhh...no good yet...remove a little more and try the fit...and so forth. But I'm stumped on how to remove a little core wax evenly to maintain even rotation during play.

Your idea of using cloth tape on the mandrel ends makes perfect sense for coaxing a near ridge-less Concert cylinder to seat properly and stay put for playing. Please keep us posted when you try it sometime.

Thanks again,
Doug

[rgordon939]

I’ve used the convex side of a file. I lay the cylinder on a soft cloth and while slowly rolling the cylinder I run the file on the inside of the cylinder. By rolling it slowly it seems to keep it from going out of round.

Rich Gordon

[ChuckA]

Basically I did it similar to Rich's method, by hand. The records I played with were bad to start with and barely went half way on the mandrel so almost all the ridge had to be removed.

I have since picked up more bad ones that maybe only need a small amount of trimming, have to dig them out and find one that just needs half inch or so to clear the end gate.

How about an offset reproducer for Columbia Grands? Won't help a GG but not many of them out there anyway.

Chuck

[FellowCollector]

I’ve used the convex side of a file. I lay the cylinder on a soft cloth and while slowly rolling the cylinder I run the file on the inside of the cylinder. By rolling it slowly it seems to keep it from going out of round.

Rich Gordon

Thanks for your input, Rich. I was wondering if a method like this might work if the core wax removal is done very evenly all around the inside.

Basically I did it similar to Rich's method, by hand. The records I played with were bad to start with and barely went half way on the mandrel so almost all the ridge had to be removed.

I have since picked up more bad ones that maybe only need a small amount of trimming, have to dig them out and find one that just needs half inch or so to clear the end gate.

Thanks Chuck. I think I'll also try Rich's method on a somewhat moldy condition Concert cylinder I have here. Makes perfect sense and worth a try.

Doug

[gramophoneshane]

I WISH that someone would make a Concert size

I'm not sure I understand why a Concert size reamer couldn't be made.
Using a C mandrel as a sample for a wood Turner to make a reamer of the correct taper only extended an inch or 2 either end following the same taper.
Perhaps a base could be attached to the large end of the reamer to anchor it in a vertical position, and a fine sand paper could be glued to the entire mandrel surface evenly, without any overlapped edges, creases or bumps.
Then you could gently lower the cylinder on the mandrel and using both hand rotate the cylinder carefully and evenly on the reamer while controlling the downward pressure that may cause the cylinder to jam, split or break.

You might have to experiment with different grades and types of sand papers on some moldy standard cylinders to determine which works best without clogging..
Depending on how quickly the chosen sandpaper appears to remove material from the moldy cylinder, it may only take a quarter or a full turn of the C cylinder to remove enough of the ribs to make them fit.
Again you might need to experiment with how many rotations are needed to alter its position on the mandrel.
First couple times I used it, I would be checking the reamed cylinder on the machines mandrel after every ¼ to half turn on the reamer, until you had a better feel for how many rotations might be too many.

[fmblizz]

Here is a little something I started fooling around with since Doug put out the question on a reamer for
the larger /Concert/Grand cylinder..

I started off using a reproduction slide-on mandrel from my Columbia AB.
I cut a circular piece of ¾" plywood slightly smaller then the diameter of the mandrel to keep
everything raise from the base panel that this will be screwed to.
I drilled a ¾" hole in the center of the plywood approximately ¼" deep so I could countersink the head
of a six inch long, 7/16 bolt . I then drilled a 7/16th hole completely through the center of that
¾" countersink hole so I could slide the bolt completely through it..
I found that 7/16" was a good diameter to fit through the small opening of the mandrel..
Once this was done I hammered the head of the bolt flush with the bottom of the plywood disc basically
locking it into the plywood.

I screwed the disc with the bolt though it onto a base panel, something I could move to a work
area/bench and clamped it in place.

This allows me to have two free hand to hold, spin and control the cylinder I will be working on.

Now came the time to slide the mandrel over the arrangement , small taper side up and using a large
washer and wing nut I able to tighten it stationary to the base board. I might utilize a piece of rubber or
gasket material under the large washer to make sure the mandrel does not spin while I am reaming the
cylinder.

Right now I am waiting for the self adhesive sandpaper to arrive and I will start off by putting 4 one inch
strips lateral onto the mandrel.. (as seen by the temporary blue tape) I'm starting with a 100 grit but may
have to adjust.

Click on picture to enlarge..

Any remarks or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

blizz

[FellowCollector]

Nicely done, Blizz! Now, the objective will be to get what you've done so far to be available for the rest of us with Concert size cylinders needing reaming!

Doug

[fmblizz]

Being retired I guess I have too much time on my hands.

Doesn't everyone have an old spare concert mandrel sitting around?? LOL

blizz