An HMV portable made in Germany ?

[poodling around]

I haven't seen anything like this before.

I wonder what it is ?

https://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/auct ... 70e84ac8f7

[Steve]

I haven't seen anything like this before.

I wonder what it is ?

https://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/auct ... 70e84ac8f7

Yes, an Electrola portable from 1930-ish, I'd guess, made by the Gramophone Company's German affiliate. Not unusual I'd say and not particularly brilliant either. The cameras piled alongside it are probably just as worthless!

[epigramophone]

There is much about this machine which does not look "right".
I have never seen an Electrola portable carrying the HMV logo, and this transfer looks suspect.
Electrola portables had their own logo, pictured below.
Garrard turntable, so probably a Garrard motor.
Generic tonearm not even bolted to the horn!

[Steve]

There is much about this machine which does not look "right".
I have never seen an Electrola portable carrying the HMV logo. They had their own, pictured below.
Garrard turntable, so probably a Garrard motor..
Generic tonearm not even bolted to the horn.

I've seen a 101 Electrola with HMV logo before. The logo is not new and definitely appears to be "period". I'm also not convinced that is a Garrard turntable or motor? I do agree however that the tonearm looks precariously balanced on that horn and might not even be the original one......I think it could be!

[Viva-Toenail]

It's not an Electrola.

It's a Deutsche Grammophon "Gramola" portable.

In a nutshell,DGAG had the rights to use the Nipper logo within (and only within) certain parts of its "German" territories. This was the market it had formerly when, prior to WW1, Deutsche Grammophone and HMV were cooperating affiliates and had carved Europe between them. After their separation both companies adopted alternate trademarks when selling in each others markets, HMV using the "Electrola' brand in DGAG/Polyphon's market, DGAG using "Polydor" in HMV's market.

Back to my years of lurking....

Arvin

[Inigo]

These DGAG machines are very interesting. I've been always curious about the German DGAG-Gramola machines, especially the rare Elektri-Grammophon, the German line of gramophones with long internal horns and large mica reproducers, sister to the British HMV "Listen to the bass" line of machines of 1925, just prior to the launching of Electrola line machines. I've seen only one large table model, similar to the HMV 126, very interesting, which appeared in German eBay many years ago. I look after them from time to time, not frequently nor extensively, I confess, but I have acquired the overall feeling that it is indeed a rare line of machines not frequently seen.
Years ago I acquired a full box of DGAG 12" 1925-1930 record sleeves from a German colleague collector. They are all in beige paper with green ink. They are very interesting, full of advertising, and the Elektri-Grammophon brand appears in many of them, as does the Polydor brand, and the curious US Brunswick-DGAG agreement era logo of the navy soldier waving two flags in his arms... Pity that all advertising is text and logos, no machines depicted nor described.
Some photos from the web

[Steve]

It's not an Electrola.

It's a Deutsche Grammophon "Gramola" portable.

In a nutshell,DGAG had the rights to use the Nipper logo within (and only within) certain parts of its "German" territories. This was the market it had formerly when, prior to WW1, Deutsche Grammophone and HMV were cooperating affiliates and had carved Europe between them. After their separation both companies adopted alternate trademarks when selling in each others markets, HMV using the "Electrola' brand in DGAG/Polyphon's market, DGAG using "Polydor" in HMV's market.

Back to my years of lurking....

Arvin

So DG name co-existed with Electrola after 1925? I do realise it still exists today but sometimes in history names are purchased and resurrected from the grave!
What date is the Gramola?

[Viva-Toenail]

This model dates to roughly just before the war. It was later branded “Polydor” when production resumed post war (DGAG stopped using Nipper on their machines just before the war). The model is known as the “5a.” You can see the pre-war version (with Nipper) in use via this post on the German gramophone forum.

In some tangential threads on the aforementioned forum, comparison has been made between DGAG/Polyphon’s “5a” and the perhaps more famous Telefunken “Lido.” Both portables are noticeably “Deco” in design (a la the curved “Deco” Salon Deccas) and forward-looking re consumer fashion trends. Both were designed just before WW2 but brought back with success afterwards. One product being a direct response to the other can be inferred, but I have not seen any definitive proof (e.g., a secret corporate memorandum).

Per my earlier post, it was my understanding that initially “Gramola” was resurrected from the pre-split HMV/DGG days for branding purposes for what we in hindsight would view as DGAG’s pre-electric line of machines. Upon the arrival of the electric process, the branding of “Polyfar” was invented (a naming heavily influenced by DGAG’s corporate parent Polyphon) for their electric-process capable models. Due however to the very complicated legal restrictions of the use of trademarks with The Gramophone Company (apparently both companies were on occasion out of compliance in abiding, especially in advertising), there are sometimes found electric-process “Gramolas.” Add to that confusion the normal fog-of-war mixing and matching of parts in repair, the blending of branding and parts becomes even more of a muddle. On the German forum I was at least amused / assured to read that this confusion is not solely limited to those of us observing outside the German market!

Back to years of lurking….
Arvin

[Viva-Toenail]

PS - I have no doubt presented a severely abbreviated overview of the entire confusing trademark naming issue . It’s as best as I can try to encapsulate without delving into case by case examples and I can’t say I have a complete grasp of all the minutiae and exceptions. Apologies if I’ve only complicated the already confusing understanding of the topic! What I can say definitively is that the gramophone is a DGAG machine, known as the “5a,” which was sold pre and post War with a branding change to Polydor. Whether it was ever officially a DGAG “Gramola” or a “Polyfar” (names which DGAG used in their marketing as well as on-machine branding) I’m still a bit hazy comprehending, if not relaying.