Columbia Type AN Production Time Frames

[Couch Potato]

Added a Columbia Type AN to my collection Serial Number 70015. I understand these originally were offered late 1896 maybe first of 1897 but for how long did they offer them? I think it is about ⅔'s up the serial number ladder for AN's and I know they share serial numbers with the Type A's both Washington and New York varieties. My serial number tag says New York on this one and the upper works while faint has gold leaves and red berries. Just trying to get a feel for what the end date was for the AN, or even the A's for that matter. I understand from the Hazelcorn book these were more or less made to burn off inventory of parts. Were they still selling them come 1898-99 1900?

Hard to do Google Searches successfully on some of these types of machines since it thinks A and AN are words not descriptors....

[phonospud]

I have one as well. NY decal and the later A style upper works. Off hand I don’t have access to the serial number.

[TinfoilPhono]

I doubt there are any production figures, or even a clear-cut end point. When Columbia replaced the Type N with the new Type A in 1897 they were stuck with an unknown number of leftover N motors, which were much more robust than the new A motor. To liquidate them Columbia put the new Type A topworks on the N bedplate and motor, and installed them into a somewhat upscaled version of the new A cabinet, with stepped base and a groove around the top lip. It was finished with a darker color than the normal A cabinet. Columbia kept the AN 'hybrid' at the old N price of $40, while the new A was only $25. They also kept the old catalog name of "Bijou." I think it's safe to assume there were few produced as compared with either N or A production. I have seen few of them in over 60 years of collecting.

Here's mine, with a wonderful metal dealer tag from the Cleveland Graphophone Co. The serial number is 73607.

[TinfoilPhono]

Further thoughts on the AN:

When Columbia released the cheaper Type A to replace the Type N, they not only had N motors left over, but also topworks -- everything to make complete machines that were now obsolete. They used the motors in the Type AN, but still had a stock of Type N topworks in storage. Those languished until around 1901 when Columbia opted to liquidate them with Type A motors sold exclusively to Montgomery Ward mail order house, under the name Thornward.

Type N serial numbers were consistent and not intermixed with anything else. In my several years of serial number research I have found a block of Thornwards starting around 47120 and running up to 47448. There are likely some numbers above or below these known ones. (The highest N I have recorded is 46051, so the lower range of Thornwards couldn't drop a whole lot.) Even if we assume a generous margin, it is highly likely that there were no more than 350 (or so) Thornwards. To be very generous we could round that to a possible 400 max, but I think that's high.

Logically, it would make sense that when Type N production ended, Columbia was stuck with the same number of N motors as topworks. The motors were a bigger investment to produce, so liquidating those would take priority over finding an outlet for remaining topworks, which is why those languished for a few years.

If my assumption is correct, there were probably only around 350 Type ANs made, the same as Thornward production.

I know of 13 Thornwards that survive, I'd wager the remaining ANs would amount to a similar number of survivors.

[ChuckA]

My serial number tag says New York on this one and the upper works while faint has gold leaves and red berries.

You have the NY chassis on your machine. I've seen a few AN's and all I've seen have NY chassis with the flowers and vines.

The Washington chassis looks like this:

The other thing I have noticed is the case coloring, I've seen them in light oak like a normal A and also in a dark oak finish.
Mine is dark oak finish, serial #60432

Chuck

[Couch Potato]

ChuckA: Yes, I stand corrected mine does have the NY Chassis. after closer inspection, I must have gotten carried away with the red berries still present on my on the back and side of the chassis. Your chassis is pretty exquisite and I appreciate you sharing pictures.

Tinfoilphono: Sounds logical. I would hope there are more than 13 of such machines. Pondering on that make me hesitant to even wind it up. You mention on the Thornwald's that the serial numbers lead you to believe there were around 400 made. Given those all seem to be close in serial number and they were $25 perhaps they just made them up more or less all at once and pushed them out the door to Montgomery Wards? Whereas the AN's seem to have serial numbers all over the map from low 50000's to the upper 70000's. Perhaps they did wish to burn off N motors but at $40 that might have been a slow go over a period time so perhaps not all sold off in 1897 but ensuing years beyond that?

Appreciate the feedback so far. -Dan-

[TinfoilPhono]

It would seem logical that Ward's committed to take the full production of Thornwards, though perhaps not in a single shipment. Still, Wards was a huge concern at the time so they could easily commit to a small number of machines, such as 350-400. The fact that there are two different designs of Thornward decals indicates that the entire production wasn't sent in a single shipment. I can easily imagine Wards committing to a total, but requesting shipments to be staggered.

The AN was a totally different story. There was no single wholesale customer, it was just one more machine in the catalog. So I'm sure they produced them more or less to order, which accounts for a very broad range of numbers intermixed with Type A Graphophones. It probably took a fair while to offload all those N motors, so production might have stretched over a few years.

[Couch Potato]

So, is there a point in time when the AN stops appearing in their catalog of offerings? Or for that matter the A's? When they introduced the AT did that push the A's and AN's to the side or did they coexist? -Dan-

[phonogfp]

So, is there a point in time when the AN stops appearing in their catalog of offerings? Or for that matter the A's? When they introduced the AT did that push the A's and AN's to the side or did they coexist? -Dan-

I haven't seen the Type AN in Columbia catalogs after early 1898. It was not in the November 1898 catalog. The Type A appeared in the catalogs right up to the introduction of the AT, which Columbia appeared to treat as the same machine - same price, same nomenclature ("The Columbia"), and the same serial number block. The early Type AT used the same plain cabinet as the Type A. Of course, retailers may have been offerings ANs and As for some time after they disappeared from Columbia catalogs.

George P.