Insuring Phonographs and ephemera

[coyote]

One topic I don't recall seeing much on is insuring one's collection. I realize different insurers and policies will vary, but does anyone have any information to share on this topic? My main concern is proof of value. Must you have a machine appraised if you don't have an original bill of sale? Also, if a reproducer is sent for repair through the USPS and lost, how would you prove value, especially if it is a relatively uncommon one which hasn't sold recently on eBay, for example? Any experiences or anecdotes would be appreciated.

[Phonofreak]

I have a rider on my home owner's insurance to cover my antiques and phonographs. It may cost extra, but well worth it. As far as sending out parts such as motors, reproducers, etc, I always insure them for the value, use priority, and delivery confirmation. When the item is completed, I have the person ship it the same way as I did. Sure it costs extra, but worth it. It cost me $14.00 to have an O reproducer sent out for repair but it was worth the extra money. I had it insured for $400.00, delivery confirmation, and signature required. I hope this helps.
Harvey Kravitz

[syncopeter]

This is a quite difficult subject. Many, many moons ago, when I still had my very valuable record collection, I had a very lengthy discussion with my insurer. He firstly insisted I made a full inventory of each and every record and its condition. When I proved that that would take me at least two years of full working weeks to complete, we agreed upon a lump sum cover of 30,000 euros. Roughly 10 euro per disc. Some were worth 1,000 euro others maybe 50 cents. But it took me about half a year to get that agreement.
With antiquities it is easy. Get a dealer in, have them give a quote, hey presto, there's you're value to insure. Whether it is realistic or not doesn't matter, you've got an autographed quote.
With our hobby it is near impossible to put a value unto something. It all depends on what it is worth to YOU. I would never pay more than 100 euro for a brass orthophonic soundbox. Because I can buy at least 4 rotten portables with perfect pot metal soundboxes for the same amount. Or more. And be assured my gramophone will sound marvelous for a long time to come. Those portables would go to the crusher anyhow at the end of the day.

[Guest]

One topic I don't recall seeing much on is insuring one's collection. I realize different insurers and policies will vary, but does anyone have any information to share on this topic? My main concern is proof of value. Must you have a machine appraised if you don't have an original bill of sale? Also, if a reproducer is sent for repair through the USPS and lost, how would you prove value, especially if it is a relatively uncommon one which hasn't sold recently on eBay, for example? Any experiences or anecdotes would be appreciated.

I have checked with my insurer more than once and I am covered under contents insurance up to a total amount.I have taken pictures and store them offsite.But the question remains how do you prove value.If an ebay printout or receipt/bill of sale great.But if not then what.An apprisal would be best but costly.Probly hard to find a appraiser that knows more than you.So think best bet would be to print as many comperable sales; EBAY and otherwise as possible.Wuold be hard to dispute.If super rare item then makes it difficult.But thaks for pointing that out as I have a few items that need some compareable printouts.

[phonogfp]

A collector friend and I do each other's appraisals. We certify that we've been collecting, buying, and selling antique talking machines and related items for ---- years, and that the amounts listed represent fair market/replacement value. We've been doing this for over 25 years, and neither of our insurance companies have a problem with it.

George P.

[coyote]

Thanks, everyone, for your helpful responses. They are greatly appreciated.

[Steve]

I think anyone who believes that their collections are insured amongst their general house contents, should examine the small print of their policy booklets and insurance schedules very carefully. I've tested numerous insurance companies with this and whilst you often get someone (without training or extensive knowledge) in a call centre reassuring you over the telephone that everything is covered, the reality in the event of a claim may be very different. Nowadays there are so many limitations imposed on policies and not just monetary ones either.

I know for a fact it would be very difficult (if not impossible) for me to get adequate insurance cover through my main household policy. To this end, I use a small private independent broker who offers a bespoke policy for my collection alone. In other words, none of the vintage stuff needs to be covered on the household contents. I have a tailor made policy that allows me to update online throughout the year, any new items added to my collection. It is expensive but it is the only way to have complete piece of mind on this matter. In the event of a claim there can hardly be any dispute about the quantity of items or their value as the policy is made for the collection and specifies EVERYTHING!

Remember too that most of us DO update things throughout the year: some items are sold, others purchased to replace existing items. If any of these are over a typical value of $1500, then they simply HAVE to be specified to be covered. No 'standard' polices for household contents to my knowledge allow you to do this?

As for valuations, I use a combination of things. If I'm friendly with the person who sold me an item, I will usually ask, in the absence of a sales receipt, for a confirmation letter stating how much the item was sold to me for. I have a few dealer valuations and several Ebay price examples to use in comparison. Where items have never appeared on Ebay I usually print off specialist saleroom examples etc

The best method though by far is to use what George Paul does! If you have a phonograph collecting friend, then why not value each other's collections? It's free and easy to do. Nice idea, George!

[1923VictorFan]

Thanks so much for starting this post. I changed insurance companies about 2 years ago after a series of annual premium hikes by the company where I had been covered for 8 or 9 years. My premiums were paid every month by auto debit and I have never had a claim so it really made me angry. Anyway, I did NOT buy special coverage for antiques or collections after changing companies because I had sold the vast majority of my "antique" items and was told over the phone that my standard policy would cover the remaining items to a max of $2500. This thread prompted me to get out my insurance policy booklet, put on my reading glasses and dive into the fine print.
Guess what? LOL. My lack of due diligence & misplaced confidence in the insurance call center agent have resulted in my not having any coverage over the last 2 years for ANY of the antique items I still own! (Of course I have to show off a few of my favorite goodies) Thanks again for the post!

[ChuckA]

To this end, I use a small private independent broker who offers a bespoke policy for my collection alone. In other words, none of the vintage stuff needs to be covered on the household contents. I have a tailor made policy that allows me to update online throughout the year, any new items added to my collection. It is expensive but it is the only way to have complete piece of mind on this matter. In the event of a claim there can hardly be any dispute about the quantity of items or their value as the policy is made for the collection and specifies EVERYTHING!

Steve,

Can you give the name of the insurance company you are using? What are the costs per insured value? I've been working with my insurance company for the past few months, trying to figure their logic on what they charge.

The phonographs are listed under "fine arts" and cost $2.40/$1000 insured value,but they want to charge $12.50/$1000 for prewar televisions as "collectables".

Thanks

Chuck

[1923VictorFan]

I did some online shopping yesterday and found several companies that will issues policies to cover antiques and collectibles but the one that most impressed me with combination of a reputable history + competitive prices is: Collectibles Insurance Services, LLC which was founded in 1966. Their minimum policy is for $3000 coverage at $14 annualy + $15 Policy Fee.
$4000 coverage = $18
$5000 coverage = $23
$6000 coverage = $27 and so on...
It's is definately worth a look and I plan to get a very small policy rather than count on my All State coverage. www.collectinsure.com