Totally new to phonographs....Silvertone?

[phonon00b]

So firstly, I know basically nothing about phonographs, except that I like them and would like to own one. I've been shopping around lately and came across this:






What do you guys think of the machine? The seller stated that it was sold in the Sears catalog (I know Silvertone is Sear's brand) in Dec 1920. It comes with the collection of records and the seller claims it plays well. It's about an hour and change away from me so I want to be thorough in researching it before I shlep all the way out.

Does the machine look to you guys to be in good shape? Any red flags standing out? What do you think a machine like that is worth? Is the sound on the Silvertones good compared to the more known victrolas and edisons?



Also, if anyone could provide me general tips on shopping for my first phonograph (keep in mind I'm on a student's budget here! , what to look for, etc, that would be fantastic. Any websites about how to take care of them or a general overview for new buyers/owners would be much appreciated as well.

[Jerry B.]

The Silvertone in your post looks like a nice machine. The mahogany finish appear original and nice. If the mechanism is in good working order, you should be able to enjoy it very much. Perhaps other Silvertone owner could comment on whether there are pot metal issues with that brand. I started my collection with a Cecilian (Wards) many years ago and I enjoyed it very much for many years. I wish you had posted the sellers asking price. If you wander through the "Trader" section, you can get an idea on prices in general. Where are you located? There is a good phono sale coming up in the near future in Wayne, NJ. Jerry Blais

[phonon00b]

The seller is asking $175. They claim that they had it appraised at $695, which I'm extremely skeptical about, but what they're asking seems reasonable to me if the machine works. I'm in the midwest; there aren't a lot of machines on offer that I've seen, they range from $150-300 and the condition from decent to fairly rough (the local antique shop had one for $350 that was missing a lot of components and in rough shape..ouch!). This one looks like it's not in bad condition and the cloth looks original (to me?) so I'm hoping it's been decently cared for and wouldn't require any repairs or restoration, since I'm looking to just have a machine to enjoy instead of a project (at this time). I'm having a bear of a time finding this model of Silvertone online, or the 1920 sears catalog to verify that it is indeed that old (since my understanding is that Sears' phonograph quality went down slightly after the mid 1920's).

What should I be looking for when evaluating a purchase; what questions should I ask the seller?

Also, forgive my ignorance, but are the steel needles one buys for these machines universal, or would I have to try to figure out and then hunt down needles for this particular model?

[VintageTechnologies]

The price sounds fair if the machine is intact.

Steel needles are universal and are most easily found on eBay. You can also buy them in three grades to control the volume: soft, medium, loud.

During the 'teens and early Twenties, there were hundreds of companies making generic phonographs and many models are not well documented yet. Sears Silvertones appear to be reasonably well made. Check the tone arm and other metal parts to be sure none are cracking, falling apart or frozen, due to being made of cheap pot metal.

The one part that surely would benefit from restoration by an experienced collector is the sound box; have the old, hard rubber gaskets replaced. Inquire on this website. Besides better sound, the records will last longer.

You should be able to lubricate most of the motor yourself without difficulty, except the insides of the mainspring. If the motor thumps or rumbles occasionally while playing, the mainspring will have to be repacked with grease.

[Valecnik]

To me the prices seems a little high for this one. I think you can find other examples in as good or better condition in the $100-125 range. $695 is crazy.

I'd also suggest you look around for Victor Victrolas, Edisons and Brunswicks. I'm not much of a Silvertone fan, although I know others here would strongly disagree!

Best advice though is don't be in a hurry. There are a lot of options out there in the $150 - $300 range. Shop around. Take your time. Ask lots of questions here. Good luck!

[phonon00b]

I wish I were more centrally located to some of these swaps etc. I saw a (sort of) local listing for a Brunswick for $400, which is out of my price range. Various other machines in the $200-300 price for random off-brands and in not the best shape (like a $300 columbia scuffed to hell and with a totally split leg that looked like it'd been glued back together with loads of crazy glue).

This one is nearby, but the seller only says "Selling antique Victrola in good condition 250.00 OBO." Does it look like a Victor Victrola? (Seems like any standing phonograph turns into a "victrola".)



I'm kind of concerned about buying a machine from someone who doesn't know anything about them, since I'm pretty ignorant myself...

[estott]

I'd say that $175 is a decent price if it is in good order, though as I just bought one myself I'm a bit prejudiced towards them: http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... =2&t=12304

They do have pot metal arms but the metal is generally stable- you won't find the arm shattering in your hands. The nickle plate finish can get a bit hazy though. This machine has an adapter to switch the reproducer to play vertical cut records. The reproducer needs a bit of care to rebuild, but you can put a Victor reproducer like a Victrola No 2 on the arm without any trouble. Some of their cabinets were built by Pooley so the construction and finish are good.

[estott]

I wish I were more centrally located to some of these swaps etc. I saw a (sort of) local listing for a Brunswick for $400, which is out of my price range. Various other machines in the $200-300 price for random off-brands and in not the best shape (like a $300 columbia scuffed to hell and with a totally split leg that looked like it'd been glued back together with loads of crazy glue).

This one is nearby, but the seller only says "Selling antique Victrola in good condition 250.00 OBO." Does it look like a Victor Victrola? (Seems like any standing phonograph turns into a "victrola".)



I'm kind of concerned about buying a machine from someone who doesn't know anything about them, since I'm pretty ignorant myself...

That is a Victor Victrola XI - if nothing is broken the sellers asking price is within reason. They are good machines, this was one of Victor's more moderately priced machines. When new the Silvertone probably cost about the same as this but offered the buyer a fancier cabinet. As far as sound goes the Silvertone will not be bad but the Victor will be a little better. In this case it comes down to price and which one you think looks better. In my opinion the Victor is attractive but a little bland.

[FellowCollector]

Does it look like a Victor Victrola?

Yes, this looks like a very common VV-X or VV-80 or VV-90. Later acoustic Victrolas had shallower lids than earlier ones (VV-X versus VV-90 for example), generally speaking. I agree with EStott that $175 seems fair (for the Silvertone) especially if phonographs are rather sparse in your area. Silvertones are more difficult to find and generally more interesting machines than the VV-X - although both should play nicely once you address any reproducer issues. Good luck.

[FellowCollector]

Yes, EStott is right. This looks more like a later VV-XI than a VV-X. I looked ery quickly at the picture. Best of luck! Doug