Swiss made gramophones

[amorite0428]

Hi, I came across some old vintage swiss/german made tabletop gramophones from late 20's in an antique shop. The price is much lower than that of a Pathé tabletop. Is it tru that these swiss/german gramophones are of lower quality than Pathé or other big brands ?

[mf77]

Is it tru that these swiss/german gramophones are of lower quality than Pathé or other big brands ?

It can be true, but rarely.
In many instances a bad one is not because it has a Swiss motor etc, but it's because the cabinet maker/ gramophone manufacturer have put a badly designed horn in the cabinet, or ignored tracking issues and put the tonearm in a position that will cause record wear, or similar issues.

Yes, companies like Thorens did produce some cheap & crude motors, tonearms & reproducers, but the majority are every bit as good as what major companies were using, with the exception of Orthophonic machines produced by Victor/HMV.
Many of the well known & respectable major companies, like Aeolian & Sonora, in fact used Thorens & Paillard motors, tonearms & reproducers that were exactly the same as what lesser known off brand machines were supplied with, but for some strange reason some collectors are under the false impression that because Sonora was an American brand it's superior & worthy of a place in their collection, but will consider Brand X with the same Paillard components, better horn design & a cabinet of equal or better quality to be worthless junk because they've never heard of the brand name or it's of foreign manufacture.
Many American Pathé machines used Heinemann "motors of quality", which are in fact of inferior quality that it's Swiss counterpart, particularly those made by Paillard.

When looking at a potential off brand purchase, I think it's more important to consider things like pot metal and tracking issues rather than writing it off as junk because it used Swiss made components.
In many instances, having a motor made by Thorens or Paillard is a good thing, because these companies produced just as many motors over the years as Victor did, so parts are very easy to find.
Many main springs were of a common size used by some clock manufacturers, so these can be also be readily replaced with brand new springs.

[amorite0428]

how about the sound box(reproducer) of thorens? is it as good as the others

[mf77]

Thorens made a huge variety of soundboxes over the years, with both mica & alloy diaphragms.
None of their later soundboxes will match the sound quality of Victors Orthophonic, but they can sound just as good as the Orthophonic style boxes made by Columbia & Brunswick etc, or Victors No.4's.

Those with a mica diaphragm are a different story.
Many earlier Thorens boxes used the same size diaphragm as those used on the Exhibition, and some were almost exact copies but with slightly different needle bar pivots, probably to avoid patent issues. When restored, the sound quality of these will usually equal that of an Exhibition, and can also be restored using the same rubber parts used for an Exhibition.
Thorens boxes that use a larger diaphragm than the Exhibition will normally outperform the Exhibition when restored.
Thorens did start to make pot metal boxes and arms about half way through WW1 due to metal restrictions imposed due to the war, and after the war, pot metal, brass & steel (or a combination of these) were all used for soundboxes & tonearms. Personally I try to avoid pre-Orthophonic era examples with pot metal because even if they appear to be stable as they can slightly warp, or may break when pulled apart for restoration, but I've never had a lick of trouble from steel and brass example.