why the overlooked Victrola #2 deserves a SECOND LOOK

[Kryptosmaster]

I had a case like that where the needle always sat at an angle and it turned out that there was a small remnant of a broken needle stuck and rusted in the needle hole. Someone on this forum suggested this and I was able to scrape out the needle hole. Now the needle goes in straight.
Good luck
Andreas

It's not actually the needle, it's the whole part that holds the needle. Here's some pics. You can see I had to,crank the screw in on the mica side in order to get it to touch.
Now I think if I have to readjust that, I'll need to take the waxed screw out, right? Might damage the mica if I loosen the springs and try to straighten it?

Not only does your needle bar look bent (pushed inward) but...you have the wrong needle screw on this #2. The bent bar is causing your problem.

That's the screw they sold me at the Wyatt's musical America place.

So are you talking about the bar along the bottom or the bar that hooks up and touches the mica? If at was bent IN wouldn't the needle be tilted the other way? Since it would ave touched the mica too soon in the adjustment procedure.

[gramophone78]

This is what your needle bar or "needle arm" ( to use Victor's terminology) & screw on a Victrola #2 should look like. Yours is very deformed and best to locate another bar for best results.

[Kryptosmaster]

This is what your needle bar & screw on a Victor #2 should look like. Yours is very deformed and best to locate another bar for best results.

Victor #2 Needle Bar & Screw.JPG

Yeah I see that now. I just found a pic online. I guess I have nothing to lose by trying to bend it back.

Mine is the top pic, bottom s one I found on eBay
The screw really doesn't matter does it? Sees to work fine, just looks different. I'll call up that place and [Fifi] if it matters.

[gramophone78]

Your pics are too small to see very good. You can try to bend it. However, it will probably break. You may have to heat it first. That will detach it from the rest of the bar. I think the real point is being lost here. These reproducers were treated like a "watch" with regards to precision. Victor used to state this. So, for the reproducer to function "as it was designed to".....you will need to have the bar reshaped exactly as it was. Not an easy task and in truth....I believe can not be done.
It also appears your bar was repaired at some point. However, given your pics.....I can't be sure.

[Kryptosmaster]

Your pics are too small to see very good. You can try to bend it. However, it will probably break. You may have to heat it first. That will detach it from the rest of the bar. I think the real point is being lost here. These reproducers were treated like a "watch" with regards to precision. Victor used to state this. So, for the reproducer to function "as it was designed to".....you will need to have the bar reshaped exactly as it was. Not an easy task and in truth....I believe can not be done.
It also appears your bar was repaired at some point. However, given your pics.....I can't be sure.

I tried to post full size pics but they were rejected as too big so I used thumbnails. Just click on them and they enlarge.
I see no repairs. It was a little rusty when I got it so thats probably what you see. Had I known the bar was bent I wouldn't have bought it.
Yeah I figured I'd try heating it. I understand your point about being like a watch. It actually sounds fine to me, I'm more concerned with it wearing the records due to the needle angle. I mean, if I can bend it close, it can't be any worse than it is now.
I'm going to look into getting another one. I can probably get a whole soundbox for almost the same price as a new needle bar from one of those suppliers. Got a real "Vaseline" feeling from the guy who sold me 5 bearings, a race and upper tone arm pin.

[Player-Tone]

Is there a video showing how to fine tune adjust the springs on the needle arm? I'm guessing I may have to melt the wax, take it apart again and reset it?

The best and most effective way of doing this will involve seperating the needlebar from the diaphragm like you said.

(Nevermind that second part, I realized the mica is too wavy to work like a mirror.)

-I have been meaning to upload some How-To videos on common reproducer rebuilds such as the Exhibition, Vic #2 and Orthophonic. I think there is only one video for the Victrola No.2 on YT right now and it dosen't cover the important step of balancing the needlebar.

[gramophone78]

Is there a video showing how to fine tune adjust the springs on the needle arm? I'm guessing I may have to melt the wax, take it apart again and reset it?

The best and most effective way of doing this will involve seperating the needlebar from the diaphragm like you said.

However, it is possible to balance the needlebar without removing it from the diaphragm. Use the diaphragm like a mirror and look at the reflection of a distant object. If the needlebar is centered properly the diaphragm will be straight and reflect the image perfectly, however if there is pressure the reflection will become distorted due to the diaphragm being pushed/pulled out of shape. This works best if viewing a distant reflection, the distortion is more pronounced.

-I have been meaning to upload some How-To videos on common reproducer rebuilds such as the Exhibition, Vic #2 and Orthophonic. I think there is only one video for the Victrola No.2 on YT right now and it dosen't cover the important step of balancing the needlebar.

Mike, I understand you are a newer collector and I do wonder how many Victor reproducers you've rebuilt. That said, the best way to rebuild a Victor reproducer is by following the instructions that Victor themselves have written. Most of the long time collectors I know(myself included) do...

[Player-Tone]

Nevermind that second part, I realized the mica is too wavy to work like a real mirror. The idea popped in my head as I was typing but I didn't try it.

[Kryptosmaster]

That said, the best way to rebuild a Victor reproducer is by following the instructions that Victor themselves have written. Most of the long time collectors I know(myself included) do...

Yeah I used the YouTube video. It does skimp a bit on the spring settings but wouldn't have helped much in my situation. I did get mine set as best you can with a bent bar.

So are these original Victor instructions somewhere on the web? I was unable to find anything so went with the video.

I'll tackle rebending that bar tomorrow.

[OrthoSean]

Mike, I understand you are a newer collector and I do wonder how many Victor reproducers you've rebuilt. That said, the best way to rebuild a Victor reproducer is by following the instructions that Victor themselves have written. Most of the long time collectors I know(myself included) do...

Does it matter how many Mike has or hasn't done? I gave Mike offline tips some time back on how to balance the needle bar springs, it's tricky and no two are the same from my experience (100+ rebuilds of #2s alone). The Victor instructions are helpful, yes, but even they leave a bit to be desired. Nowhere in Victor's bulletin does it mention replacing balance springs unless, of course, they're broken. I've found that most springs, whether broken or not need replacing since they lose their temper, which will cause issues trying to balance them. After almost three decades of doing this, I still find ways to improve my rebuilds. It's just like jukebox stuff (which I know you can relate to), the original service notes may be a useful guide, but since these were written, many things have changed to improve results, I know I've learned a lot through the help of others that isn't "in print".

I watched that video on YT just out of curiosity and while it appears to be somewhat helpful, the guy does things I'd never do, such as use GLUE! And interesting at the end how he "plays" it. Doubtful what we hear is that reproducer at all.

Sean