Edison Phonograph to refinish or not??

[Valecnik]

It's Its' History ! Its over 100 years old and in nice condition , Just clean it up ! There are hundreds of over restored machines out there , you could even invent a little history of your own with it displayed as it is " this is where my Great Aunt Maude crashed into the machine with her stiletto in the 1920's she broke the only jazz cylinder we had and slashed the transfer " make someone laugh at least

It made me laugh!

My vote would be to definitely leave it as is. There are plenty of over restored machines out there as was mentioned.

[celticguitar666]

I would clean it leave as original as possible. I lucked out with my Victrola I bought 30 years ago so and it was near perfect it has character from my own use maybe a scratch here or so but I like it so it's up to you a garage queen or a daily driver
Dwight

[Mr Grumpy]

Just going to throw this out there...

I never said go ahead and over-restore it.
But then again, I guess we all have different opinions of what an over restored machine is.

I don't leave dents and rust on my car because it's part of its history.
Telling people the great story about that time someone hit it while it was parked and then drove away.
I also wouldn't paint it candy-apple red with flames across the side if it wasn't a factory option,
and I'd go to great lengths to insure I do a quality job.

Different strokes for different folks...

[Cody K]

Flash, if it were my phonograph, I would take a wad of 0000 steel wool, dip it in good paste floor wax, and clean it by rubbing along the grain of the wood, then buff it with a soft cloth. It's a shame the decal is damaged, but even with the "D" missing, no one's going to mistake it for one of those cheesy Elison machines.

I don't think good ol' Gojo, or its big brother New Life, is the answer here; they'd soften the finish too much. The biggest problem the machine has now is that it looks a little scruffy. Probably the finish has roughened a bit with time, and the wax and steel wool treatment will both clean it and smooth the finish; buffing will do the rest. This is what the early collector Bill Kocher, who taught me so much, used to do back in the 'sixties. He rarely had to refinish a machine, and all his machines -- and clocks -- were beautifully kept.

I wouldn't rub too hard on the first go-round, because you don't want to lighten the finish very significantly or the decal will stand out. It's a small job, and it's better to do it twice than to scrub off too much in the first place.

Unless the decal is actually flaking, you can give it too a light, cautious going over with the steel wool and wax, just enough so that the surface will match the rest of the case. Use a little more pressure, with your thumb (or even the used eraser end of a pencil to drive the steel wool), in the bare-wood areas in the folds of the decal, just to be sure they're not left darker than the rest of the case. The whole case should only be at most half a shade lighter when you're done, but it will look clean and smooth, and once buffed I think you'd be pleased with the way it looks.

It looks like the damage on the top of the case could be mitigated by using a slightly coarser steel wool with wax, followed by 0000, and rubbing harder in that area than elsewhere on the case. This would leave you with a noticeably lighter area, but I believe it would be less noticeable than the scraped area that's there now.

That's all I'd do, anyway. But really, as others have said above, it's your phonograph, and you get to decide how you want it to look. Either way, once spruced up it will be a really nice machine again.

[Brad]

I too would not refinish a machine in as good original shape as this one. If the decal bothers you, buy a replacement decal, cut out the damaged word and hold it in place to see if looks right or not. If it looks good, clean and overlay, if not, learn to live with it.

As for the top, I would recommend a good cleaning (ala Kotton Kleanser) then waxing with a dark colored paste wax or even shoe polish, then, when you display the machine, have the bad side face the wall. It is amazing what you can't see when you can't see it .

[soundgen]

Flash, if it were my phonograph, I would take a wad of 0000 steel wool, dip it in good paste floor wax, and clean it by rubbing along the grain of the wood, then buff it with a soft cloth. It's a shame the decal is damaged, but even with the "D" missing, no one's going to mistake it for one of those cheesy Elison machines.

I don't think good ol' Gojo, or its big brother New Life, is the answer here; they'd soften the finish too much. The biggest problem the machine has now is that it looks a little scruffy. Probably the finish has roughened a bit with time, and the wax and steel wool treatment will both clean it and smooth the finish; buffing will do the rest. This is what the early collector Bill Kocher, who taught me so much, used to do back in the 'sixties. He rarely had to refinish a machine, and all his machines -- and clocks -- were beautifully kept.

I wouldn't rub too hard on the first go-round, because you don't want to lighten the finish very significantly or the decal will stand out. It's a small job, and it's better to do it twice than to scrub off too much in the first place.

Unless the decal is actually flaking, you can give it too a light, cautious going over with the steel wool and wax, just enough so that the surface will match the rest of the case. Use a little more pressure, with your thumb (or even the used eraser end of a pencil to drive the steel wool), in the bare-wood areas in the folds of the decal, just to be sure they're not left darker than the rest of the case. The whole case should only be at most half a shade lighter when you're done, but it will look clean and smooth, and once buffed I think you'd be pleased with the way it looks.

It looks like the damage on the top of the case could be mitigated by using a slightly coarser steel wool with wax, followed by 0000, and rubbing harder in that area than elsewhere on the case. This would leave you with a noticeably lighter area, but I believe it would be less noticeable than the scraped area that's there now.

That's all I'd do, anyway. But really, as others have said above, it's your phonograph, and you get to decide how you want it to look. Either way, once spruced up it will be a really nice machine again.

I almost think you should be paid for that !

[Cody K]

What a kind compliment, Soundgen -- thank you! But there's something to be said for free advice: when it works, it's priceless; and if it doesn't, at least it was free!

[Jerry B.]

If that Standard were in my collection and if a visitor's comments centered around the flaws like "too bad the decal is half gone" or "why do you think the lid looks intentionally scratch, do you suppose someone scraped off a reproduction decal?", it would be obvious to me that the finish is a distraction. If it's a distraction, I would try to fix it. Some suggestions were made for repairing the lid. I would try them. I'd buy a Cline decal so see if the color and general appearance is similar and worthy of trying to splice part of a reproduction decal with the remains of an original. If my attempts at a repair failed, I'd refinish the whole thing. There, I said it, I'D REFINISH IT!!!

Anonymous Collector

[pughphonos]

Just going to throw this out there...

I never said go ahead and over-restore it.
But then again, I guess we all have different opinions of what an over restored machine is.

I don't leave dents and rust on my car because it's part of its history.
Telling people the great story about that time someone hit it while it was parked and then drove away.
I also wouldn't paint it candy-apple red with flames across the side if it wasn't a factory option,
and I'd go to great lengths to insure I do a quality job.

Different strokes for different folks...

+++++++++++++++++

I'm weighing in on this belatedly. Let me hasten to say RIGHT OFF that this is all individual preference and there are valid arguments on both sides. But on this one I have to largely agree with Mr. Grumpy. Machines are there to serve us, not the other way around. Now, with antique and historic machines, many good surviving examples SHOULD be preserved untouched as museum pieces--and ARE. But not every last mass-produced antique phonograph has to be treated like it's an Abraham Lincoln artifact. Ones that are dinged/damaged to the point where they are distractingly ugly can be restored...and the experts can tell the difference between an original finish and one that's been restored. I've always argued that it's more important to keep alive the interest in these machines than to treat every last one of them as some sort of Holy Grail.

Oh, BTW, Mr. Grumpy: what an excellent piece of writing! Love your wit.

[De Soto Frank]

Personally, I do not attempt cosmetic work on talking machines, automobiles, or other old things unless I know for certain that I can make it "look better (and correct) than it does presently"...

I've botched enough well-intentioned clean-ups / partial restos to know when I should leave well enough alone.


That said, as far as this machine goes, I wonder if it is feasible to remove the old decal, apply a new Greg Cline decal, then blend-in the finish ? I think trying to piece-in a new decal will probably look very obvious...

The lid is another story... it looks as though that finish is shot, and would probably be well-served by quality refinishing, using original type materials and methods.