Our Edison Gem Phonograph - a few questions

[Lucius1958]

Hi Dulcetto




Lastly I need to read up how the reproducer works. Mine has a clear plastic disc which I think has being punctured in the middle; hopefully there are suppliers of suitable replacements?

Thanks again,
Chris

The diaphragm is most likely mica (it should feel somewhat scratchy under your fingernail). As the reproductions are generally not the original thickness, it might be better to replace it with a copper diaphragm, as used in later Edison reproducers.

The function of the reproducer is easy enough to describe: the stylus rides in the grooves of the cylinder, and transmits its vibrations through a link to the diaphragm. The horn then focuses the sound waves to make them more audible.

When you purchase a new diaphragm, remember to get some new gaskets as well: the old ones have surely petrified, and will probably break up when you remove them anyway.

I would highly recommend Eric Reiss's The Compleat Talking Machine: it is an indispensable source of advice for restoration.

Bill

[Dulcetto]

Hi Chris , the small horn in the ebay listing that you provided a link to ,will possibly fit your Gem ok and as it is of fairly small dimensions and therefore lighter in weight than a 'standard ' 14 inch horn of that style , it should not cause any undue wear on your Gem's feed-screw when in operation. I say ' possibly fit ' as although most collectors may think of phonograph reproducer outlet tubes on this style of reproducer to be the exact same dimensions, they are not -- I know from experience. There were tiny dimensional differences between manufacturers. Before purchasing any horn , it is well to ask for an accurate exact internal measurement of the end of the horn to see if it will fit on your reproducer neck ok. The other thing I would say is , yes it may well fit , but is not the correct style of horn for your Gem. Also , the sound quality of the reproduction using these small Witch's Hat horns is fairly less than desirable -- you will not be impressed -- take it from me ! The small horn in the ebay listing is known as a Witch's Hat pattern, and that particular size was made and supplied new with small size Columbia phonographs ( called Graphophones by Columbia ) particularly their Type AA and Q series models. Also by some other manufacturers , particularly in Germany. Your Edison - Bell Gem would have had a shape of horn that flares continuously from the narrow end to the wide mouth --- the style known by some manufacturers of the day as a "Herald " horn, which is a bit of a misnomer really ! British made Edison - Bell Gems , as well as American made Edison Gems of the earlier variants, sold in the UK , were supplied with a 10 X 8 Herald horn ( that's 10 inches long and 8 inches diameter across the mouth. ). At the present time , no - one as far as I am aware is making reproductions now , but second hand reproductions as well as original orphan horns do turn up reasonably often on UK ebay. You really don't want to go the the expense of importing a reproduction horn from USA , as for one thing it is not the correct style , but you are more than likely to get clobbered by HMRC to pay import VAT as well as Royal Mail charging you as well for the privilege of paying HMRC ! ( Anything commercial imported from USA declared at more than GBP 18 including the postage amount is liable to import VAT on the whole amount. ). The plastic disc to which you refer in your reproducer is probably the mica diaphragm ( which looks like plastic to an untrained eye ) --- but if it really is plastic , it will not function properly. Regarding your reproducer , sounds like it may well need an overhaul at the very least which you should entrust to someone who knows what they are doing with reproducers. Reproducers are by no means complicated , but small component parts are easily damaged by someone who is not familiar with them , albeit with the best intentions. Also , if your reproducer needs a replacement diaphragm , a specialist restorer will have the necessary parts to hand. Keith Badman in Devon has been well known as the UK's leading reproducer specialist for more than 40 years . There are of course other collector / restorers who would be able to help. Good Luck ! Dulcetto

[clevelander]

Regarding import duties
If anyone is interested, I can supply details of a code which reduces duties on any antiques imported into the UK.
Regards,
Alistair.

[ChrisM]

Thanks again for the great advice!
I had a nice conversation with Keith Badman and my reproducer will be in the post to him today for his expert attention
He has also suggested some contacts regarding obtaining the aluminium horn, although if there is anyone on this Forum who has one they wish to go to a good home please get in touch!
...I still need to find that little mandrel shaft collar screw and the four baseplate knurled screws.
Chris

[ChrisM]

Hi Dulcetto
I've found this aluminium horn (eBay Item #381612359863). It is 30cm (11.8") diameter by 40cm (15.7") long, so bigger than the 10 x 8 you quoted but it is light weight(225g). I cant work out what the copper part is at the narrow end but do you think it's worth an enquiry?
Cheers
Chris

[Dave D]

The ⅛" diameter you measured suggest that this is a 5-40 thread pitch, which was used by Edison a lot here in the States. Do you have any idea what the original nut looked like?
Dave

[ChrisM]

Hi Dave
They are 5-40 thread. Here's a picture of a (UK) GEM that was sold on eBay showing the knurled base-plate nuts. They are cleverly shaped such that they can be screwed on in either orientation, fitting into the countersunk hole:

Cheers.
Chris

[Dave D]

I don't see any knurling. Are they just round?

Dave

[Dulcetto]

Yes , those little acorn shaped nuts are lightly knurled , although not easy to see in the photo you have pinched from ebay. Often the knurling on these little nuts is almost as light as what you might call 'scratching', and often is fairly worn due to repeated un-screwing and screwing on again as the removal of the mechanism was periodically required for maintenance , adjustments etc. Incidentally I was the seller of the machine you show in the picture , it is my photograph I used for the ebay listing. I have already given you information regarding the style and size of horn that was sold new with your phonograph and therefore as to to whether any horn you see offered for sale is suitable , either an original or a reproduction , you must use your own judgement as to whether it will suit your needs. There are various reasons why the original horns were a particular shape , size and weight for a particular model of phonograph and if you want to know all the relevant answers , you need to spend about 20 years or more gaining the experience and knowledge required to fully understand what you need to know , as indeed you would for any specialist skill or interest ! Regards Dulcetto

[Dave D]

It looks like you have an endgate. Why do you need that mandrel shaft collar? Doesn't the endgate hold the mandrel in place?
Dave