The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

De Soto Frank wrote:

Victrolacollector wrote:We have heard of self winding watches, I am wondering if anyone has seen a motor that self winds, I think it is possible, a gear could be winding the springs as it plays for continued power. Just wondering if this was ever done.

Actually something like this was created back in the 17th-18ths centuries to help get watches and clocks to run more consistently...


Google "fusee`"...

I know I'm entering the conversation late, but, the fusee was not meant to provide power, only to help the power of the spring to be more evenly applied.

soundgen wrote:

JerryVan wrote:

soundgen wrote:What you need is a perpetual motion machine , David Jones who used to write in New Scientist under the pseudonym of Daedalus is always making them , he used to offer a prize if anyone could work out how they were powered , they just run and run ! Here is one in the Technical Museum of Vienna
It's been going for years !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHQ33OFljOg

It's a Sterling Cycle heat engine. They can operate at very small differences in heat energy.

But they still need an energy input !


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirling_engine

Yes, that was my point.

P.S. Thanks for the spelling correction Wayne!

Just a few more comments here, not to wander
too far off topic:

The original topic was about the concept of a
self-winding motor.

This idea would imply that the motor would
somehow use it's own spring power to attempt
to be used to wind that same spring.

That can not work, because friction uses up
some of the stored energy, converting it to heat.

This whole concept leads off into the realms
of "free energy", and "perpetual motion" machines.

Indeed I recently heard a radio program where
some guy was expounding upon a "free energy"
scam that he has going which involves an
electric motor mechanically coupled to an
electric generator. He claims that once brought up to speed, this contraption will
run "forever".

No, it won't. In fact it will coast down to
a dead stop and it will not take much longer
than if no electrical connection be made
between generator and motor! Why?

Friction, and an efficiency of less than 100%,
that's why.

Then, some others here have mentioned Sterling hot air engines. Those do work.

However, and my real point here in this post
is to convey the fact that in order to make
real, practical use of an energy source, that
source must be robust in the first place!

Known energy sources such as the intense heat
of a burning coal fire to boil the water in a steam boiler is a good example of this.

Nuclear energy is another source that has
almost unlimited heat potential which can
be used (among other things) to heat and boil
water in a steam boiler. Too bad that humanity as a whole is not mature enough yet
(and may never be), to use this energy safely!!

Right now, there is a huge push on to get away
from known, proven, and robust energy sources
such as coal, oil, and nuclear.

Now we are instead moving off to wind and solar
which are far less robust energy sources.
It takes more hardware and a lot more effort
and cost for much less return to use these relatively weak energy sources.

Self-winding motor?

I suggest eating some good beef steak and
turning the crank!

Chuck

Chuck wrote:

Self-winding motor?

I suggest eating some good beef steak and
turning the crank!

Chuck

RIGHT ON !

Good! I'll leave all my Evan Williams records out where they can find them!

In 1919, The Edison company DID offer a self-winding Chippendale. It was 380 pounds and perfectly practical, provided you could carry it & wag it back & forth over a 3 to 4 mile walk for every 6 records played.

Nat wrote:Good! I'll leave all my Evan Williams records out where they can find them!

I assume you're referring to the "drones equipped with flame-throwers"...


If that's the case, I'll contribute a couple of stacks of Vernon Dalhart assorted weepy ballads !

Atmos clocks come close to being perpetual motion machines, albeit with an energy source. Even fairly small fluctuations in temperature does it. Could that be scaled up to keep a heavy spring wound? Don't know. And even if it could it would likely be much too expensive to be practical. And as for a spring rewinding itself from its own power, seems to me it is not going to happen for reasons others have aptly described.

Clay