Frozen shaft in model E cylinder machine

[FellowCollector]

I need a different approach, and I need suggestions from those who know what they're doing.

I took the time to provide a step by step procedure here to try to help you and others who might care to try it.

This procedure has worked successfully for me in my nearly 30 years of collecting and repairing my own Edison Home model D's, E's and the one model F Home Phonograph in my collection.

Just because it has not worked for you as well as the suggestions from other members doesn't mean that those who have tried to help you don't know what they're doing and I resent your statement.

I should remember to not provide step by step instructions to those who are unfamiliar with working on phonographs. I won't make the same mistake again.

Good luck with it.

[bangster]

Doug, you woefully misunderstood my meaning. I regard everybody (but me) on this message board as people who know what they're doing. I seek advice from you all. I wasn't belittling your method. It hasn't worked for me, but that doesn't make it a bad method. It just means there are machines too ornery for it. I see this board as a treasurehouse of information that I can learn from, and I respect y'all just for creating it.

As a brand newbie here, it would be totally out of place for me to criticize any of you who have undertaken to help me. That ain't my style at all. I apologize for offending you, even though it was unintentional. I'll try to be careful of my wording hereafter.

bangster

[Phonolair]

Doug has offered excellent advice and detailed steps.
Having repaired many of these myself I can add one more thing.
With a small pointed punch start to break away as much of this pot metal bearing as possible, careful not to damage the shaft
The more of this bearing you can remove the less of a grip it will have on the shaft

Larry Crandell

[ambrola]

First off, you have to pull the Dog out. Then you can remove the pulleys or at least see the end of the shaft. I would remove the dog, then try the brass punch and knock it out? The Dog is marked in red. You can just grab it with some pliers and pull it out.

Edison 1a.jpg (110.62 KiB) Viewed 1489 times

[bangster]

Isn't the "Dog" an integral part of the pulley assembly? It seems directly connected to the center gear.

[bangster]

Doug has offered excellent advice and detailed steps.
Having repaired many of these myself I can add one more thing.
With a small pointed punch start to break away as much of this pot metal bearing as possible, careful not to damage the shaft
The more of this bearing you can remove the less of a grip it will have on the shaft

Larry Crandell

Would it be useful to cut it partially with a Dremel wheel?

[Phonolair]

First off, you have to pull the Dog out. Then you can remove the pulleys or at least see the end of the shaft. I would remove the dog, then try the brass punch and knock it out? The Dog is marked in red. You can just grab it with some pliers and pull it out.

Edison 1a.jpg

The mandrel shaft needs to be pulled out first, before the rest of it can come apart.
This center bearing gear (you point out)will not pull out. It is not like the end support bearing on a model A or B.
It is a support with a gear and pivot / bearing on the end. The mandrel shaft must be pulled out a couple of inches before the belt pulley and clutch can be removed.
Then the support, gear, pivot(one piece) is pushed in, to be removed.
After removing all set and regular screws, the next step is to get the mandrel shaft out.

Larry Crandell

[bangster]

After removing all set and regular screws, the next step is to get the mandrel shaft out.

You're telling me! When I get that bugger out, I will celebrate with champagne.

[Phonolair]

Doug has offered excellent advice and detailed steps.
Having repaired many of these myself I can add one more thing.
With a small pointed punch start to break away as much of this pot metal bearing as possible, careful not to damage the shaft
The more of this bearing you can remove the less of a grip it will have on the shaft

Larry Crandell

Would it be useful to cut it partially with a Dremel wheel?

Dremel will work fine, just don't harm the shaft. This pot metal bearing is very brittle. Once you start to get it to break up, the mandrel shaft will pull out.

Larry Crandell

[Lucius1958]

The keyword here is PATIENCE. Just keep tapping carefully, and gradually weakening the old bearing, and eventually things will start to move.

Removing the end bearing may be helpful, as you can then insert an appropriately sized brass rod, and gently tap at the shaft from there.

True, clock movements never employed pot metal parts as far as I know. Keep plugging away: this machine has waited over a century - you can spare another week or two on it.

Bill