Two Edison DD record questions

[briankeith]

Why do some paper-label Edison Diamond Disc records have a big red star printed on the label? And question #2, what year did Edison start using the paper label on his DD records? I have always been somewhat curious about the red stars.

[Wolfe]

Paper labels came on in 1921. Red stars were dealer copies.

[gramophoneshane]

Records that had a red star on the label, were titles that Edison thought would be poor sellers. If a dealer ordered a "red star" title & it went unsold, it meant it could not be returned to the factory for a refund.

[phonogfp]

The red stars were a curious practice called "General Group." These were issues that would not be taken back in exchange because the Phonograph Division expected a limited interest in them. If a dealer ordered from this "General Group," he knew that they were his until he sold them, whereas other Edison releases could be returned on occasion. Those stars were a warning that the title was liable to be a slow seller!

George P.

Shane beat me to it!

[estott]

The red star was one of Edison's worst ideas.

This is copied from 78rpmrecord.com:

"You will often find Edison Diamond Discs with red stars in the middle of the title area. This does not denote a big performing star or a big star of a song. Rather, it is a record that the Edison people were predicting would be a dog. A non-seller. It was a record that dealers were not required to stock and was not subject to full credit if returned as unsold.

[So, are we saying that Edison invented the cutout bin?]

Actually not, because the rules were VERY STRICT. There was to be NO DISCOUNTING AT ALL. For ANY reason. What I had meant to say above is that the red star records could NOT be returned to the Edison company for full credit or ANY credit! Also, if the red star record did not sell, the dealer could not discount it to get rid of it. Full list price only. That is, until 1929. And then, perhaps we CAN say that Edison invented the cut-out bin--but it was the COMPANY he was cutting out! But even then you will notice that after only a few months of close-out prices they DESTROYED all remaining stock."

[phonogfp]

The more I thought about "Flashes," the less confident I became in my previous post. I dug out an issue of The Antique Phonograph Monthly from 1982 which reproduced the dealer bulletin below. I was incorrect about the "Flash" terminology, and will edit my earlier post to avoid future confusion. I should have cited "General Group." Anyway, we can all read the explanation below:

George P.

[Lucius1958]

It may be that the 'star' designation predates the paper labels. I have noticed a small star stamped on a late etched label DD in my possession....

-Bill

[alang]

I think it's interesting to mention that every paper label DD still has an etched label underneath. Most of the time when the paper label is lost only a plain paper remains, but if this is removed with alcohol it looks just like the older disks. I learned this when I once found a DD with a paper label on one side and an etched label on the other side.
Andreas

[HisMastersVoice]

I think it's interesting to mention that every paper label DD still has an etched label underneath. Most of the time when the paper label is lost only a plain paper remains, but if this is removed with alcohol it looks just like the older disks. I learned this when I once found a DD with a paper label on one side and an etched label on the other side.
Andreas

Not all. Some do have an etched label under the paper label, but others just have a brown paper label with a stamp and writing in pencil:

[briankeith]

So did Edison do the same thing with his cylinder records - poor sellers received a big red star ??