Edison Class M / SM machines - how many exist ?

[De Soto Frank]

I have always been intrigued by the Edison Class M and SM machines, with the fly-ball governor above the top-plate.


How many of these machines exist outside of museum collections ?


Thanks,

De Soto Frank

[rgordon939]

Don't know the total, but the last time I was at Charlie Humel's house he had 21 of them

Rich Gordon

[flashpanblue]

Hello,
De Soto Frank you have ask the same question that I was going to ask about the surviving numbers of Class M Phonographs. I used to think that they were rare, but reading about how many they were producing it seems that perhaps they are not. I quote from my copy of The Edison Cylinder Phonograph by Frow and Sefl page 13/14. October 1889 there were reported to be 3000 Edison Phonographs already in use in the United States, with 600 workmen engaged in production. November 1889 300 Phonographs a week were being turned out of the Edison factory, and 3000 were shortly to be introduced into the Btitish market.
It give us an idea of how popular these Class M Phonographs were and that a lot were produced.
Pete

[Andersun]

Many Class Ms were retrofitted with a spring motor either by Edison using the Spring Motor or the Chicago Talking Machine's design which had an Amet motor and front opening case as illustrated and explained on page 55 of the Fabrizio/Paul compendium book.

[edisonphonoworks]

How about treadle Edison's It seems that not only were there phonographs, which I would not think would be brisk sellers, there was treadle shaving machines in the catalog up into the early 1900s, would make you think some of those treadle shavers have survived especially since there was many businesses without electricity, although I have never seen one in a collection personally, just in books.

[De Soto Frank]

As for treadle machines, if they had fancy cast-iron bases similar to sewing machines, I wouldn't be surprised if they got re-purposed as side-tables or scrapped altogether during WW II scrap drives...


Somehow I had fallen under the impression that the number of surviving M and SM machines was in the vicinity of "a handful"...

Sounds like their survival rate might be a bit better than I thought...

[TinfoilPhono]

Class M phonographs seem to fall in a funny category. They are not rare in terms of surviving numbers, but once they land in a collection, they rarely seem to go back on the market again. And I've know several collectors who own multiple examples (like the aforementioned Charley Hummel). So even though the number of survivors is well over a handful, obtaining one can be a real challenge.

It took me a long time to find mine. I've had it for close to 20 years now, and it will not be back on the market until my daughter inherits it, hopefully much more than another 20 years from now.

Some things just don't change hands very often.

[mrphonograph]

the class type edison phonographs from the perfected spectacle to the class E concert of 1898 -1902 are all reminicent of those famous foto's of edison of 1888
thats why we don't see them on them on the market place because collectors hold on to them and yes they are not very rare just like tinfoils made for scientific school outfits that where made between 1880 and 1914! but most of those are still in the science rooms of schools univercity's or museums or where sold as scrap metal during WWI AND WWII
rare is a big word for the class type phonograph i think the army & navy edison DD is much less common than the class phono's

edison class m leather case 1892.jpg (32.12 KiB) Viewed 1953 times

edison class E wbettini rep & horn.jpg (158.59 KiB) Viewed 1953 times

edison class m motor.jpg (44.53 KiB) Viewed 1953 times

edison class m light oak case.jpg (163.85 KiB) Viewed 1953 times

edison class m spec.jpg (113.39 KiB) Viewed 1953 times

the same goes for bettini cylinders the damn thing about bettini cylinders is that there is no anouncement saying bettini record like on the edison cylinder
cylinders lose their original box in 110 years and in the case of bettini cylinders than become completly anonymous just another brown wax cylinder
so do i think there are undiscovered bettini cylinders out there.. absolutly!!
you just need to match the artist and the recorded piece to the bettini cylinder catalogue (if you can find one!!)

and do i think there is a class type phonograph somewhere up in an attic.. im convinced of it!


greetings
tino

[Victrolacollector]

I have always been skeptical that there are more Edison Class machines out there than we suspect. Also, I do agree with the previous statement that the Edison DD Army Navy model may be more rare! Last fall I visited a collector in nearby Merrillville where I sold him my Talk-O-Phone. This collector must have hundreds of outside machines including a Edison DD Army Navy machine, I was unaware how rare they are until he told me. I still kick myself because I could have bought one for $ 300.00 back in 2008 from nearby Chesterton, IN, I only passed because they are not that attractive looking, but would make for a great war relic and not only that a strong machine.


I have always thought these were great machines and always wanted one for many years but considering that my most expensive phonograph now is probably less than 1,000.00 I probably never will own one:-( Cheers to all the collectors that do. I suppose my Columbia open works (Q & B Eagle) will suffice. I am just wondering how collectors operate them now since I understand they worked on battery power? Also, where do collectors find the old glass battery tanks?

[mrphonograph]

I have always been skeptical that there are more Edison Class machines out there than we suspect. Also, I do agree with the previous statement that the Edison DD Army Navy model may be more rare! Last fall I visited a collector in nearby Merrillville where I sold him my Talk-O-Phone. This collector must have hundreds of outside machines including a Edison DD Army Navy machine, I was unaware how rare they are until he told me. I still kick myself because I could have bought one for $ 300.00 back in 2008 from nearby Chesterton, IN, I only passed because they are not that attractive looking, but would make for a great war relic and not only that a strong machine.


I have always thought these were great machines and always wanted one for many years but considering that my most expensive phonograph now is probably less than 1,000.00 I probably never will own one:-( Cheers to all the collectors that do. I suppose my Columbia open works (Q & B Eagle) will suffice. I am just wondering how collectors operate them now since I understand they worked on battery power? Also, where do collectors find the old glass battery tanks?

well with a special adaptor you can simply.....plug it in