Beethoven Archduke Trio

[CptBob]

I recently bought an album set of the Archduke, played by Thibaud, Cassals & Cortot and I've played it through once, but don't think I will again. The set is in very good condition, the sound is wonderful and the performance is exquisite, but I just can't get over the faff of having to look for the next record, change the needle and wind the machine. Am I missing something or do others feel the same as me?

[neilmack]

Shamefaced, I agree. I suspect a lot of people do - and from a commercial standpoint my record dealer has so little affection for these vast and heavy sets (one crack and the whole lot is worthless), that he usually prices them to sell. I keep a few by as nostalgic artefacts, but if I want to hear Thibaud, Casals and Cortot, then Naxos have furnished me with transfers on CD, both good and cheap. I'm still trying to complete my sets of the 1906 Messiah and 1907 Pagliacci, but otherwise I'm done with album sets. So I'm looking to re-home my Toscanini and Weingartner Beethoven Symphonies!

[beaumonde]

I agree that listening to muli-disc album sets of classical works can be a chore. That's how my 78-transferring passion originated, years ago, to listen to these uninterrupted. Along the way I found that my own transfers were in many respects superior to most commercial issues, so that was a plus.

[Wolfe]

Yes. I feel for the music lover of yore, having little option but to jump up and down every 4 minutes. Complete operas and symphonies on the radio must have seemed like manna when they came along.

Big album sets get made into digital files by me which is a chore in and of itself, but renders a certain satisfaction when finished, especially if it comes out well. Then the set can rust on the shelf or in the box.

I'm happy pick them up for cheap if it's something interesting, too. Most people price them for nothing. And like was said above, I can tailor the sound to my liking and not have to put up with muddy, over filtered transfers or what have you.

[De Soto Frank]

I recently bought an album set of the Archduke, played by Thibaud, Cassals & Cortot and I've played it through once, but don't think I will again. The set is in very good condition, the sound is wonderful and the performance is exquisite, but I just can't get over the faff of having to look for the next record, change the needle and wind the machine. Am I missing something or do others feel the same as me?

This would be the sort of thing that I would love to own, perhaps listen to once in a while, but for the reasons you mentioned, I would not pay a lot for such, and yes, they are a chore to listen to...

But, when there was nothing better, they served a purpose.

Are these electrical recordings ? If so, this is where a nice electric machine ( even a portable ) with a good changer proves its worth...

[beaumonde]

Just as an aside, some of these early classical albums are apparently worth more to certain collectors than you'd might think. Some routinely bring $25-65 or so from a certain west-coast collector/dealer on the 'bay (disclosure: I have bought many from him, but I usually low-ball my bids!).

[Cody K]

To me the biggest problem with sets is that movements are often broken into halves or even thirds to accommodate the limitations of a ~4-minute disc. That's when it gets distracting. Or when something that would ordinarily run five minutes or so is truncated to fit the side, though to be honest there aren't that many pieces that I know so well that I'd notice. And most of these alterations were done skillfully enough that they seem natural enough.

It does take an investment of energy, and even some planning, to sit down and listen to a symphony or such on a set of 78s, but really, other than the commitment to playing eight consecutive sides and the bouncing-around that entails, it's not that that much different from any other evening of playing records. You generally want to sit back while listening, though -- at least I do -- so you don't get to stay busy looking through records wondering what to play next while doing so. I think that makes it a little more laborious when you do have to change records.

I don't think this must have bothered people much when the sets were new. It must have been a great luxury! I can only imagine what it must have been like in 1927 to have a Credenza and a new set of Franck to kick back to. If you had that and a fireplace, and maybe a sip of that pre-Prohibition cognac you've been hoarding for years, you had it goin' on!

I've been looking through the Victor Book of the Opera lately, and it strikes me how there weren't any recordings available from Victor of complete operas. I assume it must have been the same with orchestral works, and thinking back I can't say I've ever seen one from earlier than the mid-'twenties. (Though there's a lot of things I haven't seen...)

It must have been something, to be able to bring home in its entirety that thing you loved at Symphony Hall last year. There wouldn't have been a sense of limitation, when you were using the finest technology of the time.

I have to remind myself from time to time, that all the dance music that sounds so of-the-'twenties to me now was the music of young people when it was new, the latest, greatest and up-to-datest stuff you could get. If you were the quieter type, it must have been pretty satisfying to stop by the record store after work on payday and pick up a new Mozart set.

I've been realizing that one of the things I like so much about old phonographs is that they promote an active sort of listening in a world where so much music -- you can't get away from music -- is heard passively. You have to choose a record, wind the machine, change the needle, and after six minutes of that, you get four minutes of music.

I've got a couple of very nice Columbia ca. 1929 sets, E+, tucked away for the glorious day when I finally finish the Credenza. I haven't played them yet, but I'm looking forward to that. And after that, I'm sure they won't be in heavy rotation. But that won't be because of the work it takes to listen to them. What that'll be because of is,

So!

Many!

Records!

So!

Little!

Time!

[beaumonde]

Cody, there were a few Victor (and Columbia) albums of complete operas, actually. All seem to have been pressed from European masters. I once owned a 1929 "Rigoletto" on something like 13 12" discs, in automatic sequence. I gave it to a friend who had just got a 10-50 changer after I listened to it (once) on my Credenza. My, what a chore!

Probably if you look at the 1930 Victor catalog, you'd see it there.

[Wolfe]

I have that set. Victor M-32. On 30 sides.

Better get them leg muscles working, baby! If you're not fortunate enough to own a changer.

[Henry]

I once turned down an opportunity to own (for free, yet!) a complete "Tristan und Isolde" because I quaked at the daunting task of lugging all those albums. In that case, the move would have necessitated all hand-carrying from a forest cabin down to a lake shore, into a small motorboat and across the water, then another shlep from boat to car, plus where to put the things once I got them home. And then how often would I ever play the damn things? I'm still not at all sorry I passed on that one!