3-D Printing Cylinder Records

[Victrolacollector]

Today, I had the opportunity to see a 3-D printer. A camera can capture all dimensions of an object and print the product out in plastic. I am wondering of these might be usable for duplicating cylinder records.

[estott]

It could be an interesting idea, but even small textural artifacts left by the depositing process are going to translate into distortions and unwanted noise.

[tinovanderzwan]

Today, I had the opportunity to see a 3-D printer. A camera can capture all dimensions of an object and print the product out in plastic. I am wondering of these might be usable for duplicating cylinder records.

no not realy the layercaking effect of the printing leaves imperfections also the object can have issues with srinking
and 3d printed objects in some cases seem to go brittle after a while cheap plastic is not advisable uv realy dries it out over time
making phono parts on the 3d is a better possibility parts like Pathé reproducers some printers can even print rubber nice for those decorated horn connectors also 3d's are pretty good for printing those pullstring talking doll voice boxes
also any phono part originaly made from coutchouc can be replicated
so yes there is a future for 3d printers in the phono collectors world but not for replicating records


tino

[phonojim]

This is just the beginning of 3D printing and if the past is any indication of the future of technology, we will able to do far more with them than we can imagine at this time. So, I wouldn't be too quick to discount the possibility of duplicating cylinders by this method in the not too distant future.

Jim

[tinovanderzwan]

This is just the beginning of 3D printing and if the past is any indication of the future of technology, we will able to do far more with them than we can imagine at this time. So, I wouldn't be too quick to discount the possibility of duplicating cylinders by this method in the not too distant future.

Jim

sure but i was talking about the here and now mostly as to the future..... we'll see

3d laser printers have a much higher resolution about 5 times the resolution of regular plastic filament printers
they use resin to print the resin is hardened by the laser light the smaller the pin point laser the higher the resolution
if any type of 3d printer is going to be able to print records it will probably be the laser resin printers

types of 3d printers
1 plastic filament
2 resin laser
3 plastic powder
4 jelly resin (laser)


tino

[VintageTechnologies]

I am pretty sceptical that a 3D printer will ever have anything near the the resolution that would be required to replicate the delicate vibrations of a record. I seem to recall reading somewhere the technical details related to molding cyliners - it was claimed the vibrations varied in depth as little as a millionth of an inch.

[tinovanderzwan]

I am pretty sceptical that a 3D printer will ever have anything near the the resolution that would be required to replicate the delicate vibrations of a record. I seem to recall reading somewhere the technical details related to molding cyliners - it was claimed the vibrations varied in depth as little as a millionth of an inch.

yes the print will have to be very high res but than again remember the ink printers of the mid 1990s those gave pretty grainy prints 20+ years ago
today on the most expensive printers can print at a supper hight pixalation you can see a persons pores and hair follicles on those
so who knows in 20+ years from now

[WDC]

Nevertheless, somewhat 'playable' discs have been already printed about a year ago by Amanda Ghassaei:

[youtubehq]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQi8FUsZ8OY[/youtubehq]

[youtubehq]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NM7hwAuXqCE[/youtubehq]

This is roughtly the current cutting edge in 3D printing resolution. And anyone can hear the imperfections of the printed lines accross the grooves. Also, the whole frequency range is roughly as low as an early 5" Berliner record. But even Berliners once did improve to something audible and later even to something quite enjoyable.

I am also more than quite confident, that in 10, 20 or 30 years it will be very possible at a decent quality. There will be likely new materials used for 3D printing, thus solving the current problems we are facing today.

And the idea is very intriguing, especially with today's possibilities of confocal microscopy scanning methods: With that, you create a 3D profile of a cylinder's groove. This information could be then used to precisely replicate not only a recording from a sound file, but rather the actual shape of the original groove.

One could call this a digitally moulded cylinder.

[Swing Band Heaven]

As she says on her video the grooves are not only much wider apart than a normal LP but are also much bigger. I wonder if part of the poor sound is due to an ill fitting stulus rattling around in a very large groove. We all know what a 78 played with an LP stulus sounds like and how poor the sound is. Just a thought....

[tinovanderzwan]

i think a too small needle does make more noise while rumbling in the grooves
this is a jelly based resin you see her scrape and wash off the exes jelly
this is quite better than i had hoped i think with good research a hard resin 78 would be possible within the next 5 to 10 years or so taking in account the jumps the 3d printers made over the last 5 to 10 years
they used a softer more flexible resin in the video i think its better to use a hard resin since for some reason you can go much higher in resolution also going from a speed of 45 wich they are using here to 78 would dramatically improve sound quality

(a hard resin print will also play on a victrola there are some moulded hard resin records in existance that play just fine on a acousic machine f.i the hard records made in the netherlands from the mid 1990s and the charlie hummel diamond disc)

also the wide groove of the 2m cylinder falls pretty nicely within the groove scale they are using as well as the audio range for for instance pre 1900 recordings again at the speed of 100 to 160 rom the quality of the sound will improve greatly

so the question of this thread was can a cylinder record be reproduced using a 3d printer and the answer must be yes it can maybe not perfect but its possible

and in ten years we probably will be able to make our own cylinders from existing mp3's
sadly this will mean that shawn borri, duncan miller, and paul morris will be out of a job by then why buy playable cylinders from them if we can make our own!

well we'll see but its a exiting development!


tino