Standard "4 minute 2" decals

[martinola]

The subject came up on another thread and rather than take it further off topic, I thought I'd post this here.

Documenting "4 minute 2" decals (transfers) is somewhat of a problem. Depending on angle of photograph, dirt on bedplate, bounce of light, etc. they often don't show at all. Unlike the other gold decorations, they were not over-coated with protective shellac and tend to wear off very easily. Many Model D machines do not appear to have them.

I think the "4 minute 2" decals were a later reaction to customer confusion. In looking over my data sheet, I see a possible one on #666577 (much damaged and hard to see), then a home-made one on 672109, 673395 has a possible repro, 685249 has one, 689806 has one as well, 696409 is probably a repro.

The run of the "4 minute 2" decals seems to begin properly at 697551 and go into the 811000s. This would be for models D and F. There are many D & F machines in this run that show no decal and others might be present but are not noted due to angle or quality of examined photos.

Ironically, the last entry I have for a "4 minute 2" decal isn't even on a machine that should have one. Model E (#811700) has one but it also has a type nine patent plate which may indicate that the machine was re-configured at least once before. My guess is that it was previously a Model F (converted from a Model D).

The big problem in getting a good reproduction is that many of the originals are very damaged. Many restorers have had to simply go with a similar font and re-build the artwork for new decals. As the original artwork for the "4 minute 2" decal was hand-lettered, using a new font is a compromise at best.

Thoughts? Suggestions? Seen any good movies lately?

Martin

[NEFaurora]

My Edison Standard Model "D" is Serial number: #682633 , and it in no way has ever had the "4-minute-2" decal. No evidence of one ever being there exists, and I've looked real hard..even with a jewler's loupe. The bedplate is Mint with all of its original Gold pin striping too.

I'm just going to order one from Gregg Cline. I want a "4-minute-2" decal. It lessens confusion about the push/pull knob...though I always remember on mine anyway, It's always annoyed me that the decal was never there to begin with.

Also, Interestingly enough. My Edison Standard Model "D" has it original top cover in excellent condition as well with its original factory chalk markings still present. The odd thing about it though is that the cover DOES NOT have a CHANGE OF REPRODUCERS notice decal, nor has one ever been there at one time either. That is another real annoyance. That CHANGE OF REPRODUCERS notice decal should be there...especially on a Model "D" machine. The top definitely matches the wood on the rest of the machine nor do I think that its an earlier model "Standard" cover either. I wish that someone would repro the CHANGE OF REPRODUCERS notice decal as I would like to add one to the inside top cover of this machine.

Has anyone ever noticed any other CHANGE OF REPRODUCERS notice decals missing on other Edison Standard Model "D" machines???..or is it just me???

)

Tony K.

Edison Collector/Restorer

[martinola]

Tony-

When it comes to Edison machines it seems anything is possible. I'm guessing you have a late style case with a type 6 patent plate (model type is suffix to serial number). There's another model D in my list just prior to yours that has no "4 min 2" decal or "change of reproducers" sticker. Let me ask - why change your machine's originality? It's your choice, but stuff like this muddles history. Anyway, good luck.

Regards,
Martin

[phonogfp]

Tony-

Let me ask - why change your machine's originality? It's your choice, but stuff like this muddles history. Anyway, good luck.

Regards,
Martin

Ditto. If you really want the "4 minute 2" decal, why not trade/sell your present machine and get a D with the decal? Leave the oddity for someone who will appreciate it.

Merriam-Webster defines "restore" as "to return (something) to an earlier or original [emphasis mine] condition by repairing it, cleaning it, etc."

George P.

[NEFaurora]

Well,

It's just a 1" water transfer decal.......and I always thought it was missing, as the same with the Change of Reproducers decal that is missing. My machine is the only one that I have ever seen missing these details. Before this thread, It did not seem like a variation, nor one that I had ever heard of concerning Standard Model "D"'s. I usually like variations, but in this case, I don't think a 1" water transfer decal will make a difference here. I intend on keeping the machine and not selling it...and it's easily removable. It's not like I'm changing an original finish or repainting an original bedplate here...and I certainly would not trade my near Mint Model "D" Standard for another machine just to get one "with the decal". That to me is kind of silly in this case...but that's just my opinion.

" I'm guessing you have a late style case with a type 6 patent plate (model type is suffix to serial number)."

Yes Martin, You're right about the Patent Plate. The model type is suffix to serial number, and not at the bottom of the plate like other models.

I've read and heard about the case differences as well. Can someone post some pics of the Early style case vs. the Late Style case. I just want to verify. The case is most certainly a different base from my Model B Standard case, but it looks like the bedplate lid is identical to the Model B Bedplate lid.

)

Tony K.

Edison Collector/Restorer

[52089]

Well,

It's just a 1" water transfer decal.......and I always thought it was missing, as the same with the Change of Reproducers decal that is missing. My machine is the only one that I have ever seen missing these details. Before this thread, It did not seem like a variation, nor one that I had ever heard of concerning Standard Model "D"'s. I usually like variations, but in this case, I don't think a 1" water transfer decal will make a difference here. I intend on keeping the machine and not selling it...and it's easily removable. It's not like I'm changing an original finish or repainting an original bedplate here...and I certainly would not trade my near Mint Model "D" Standard for another machine just to get one "with the decal". That to me is kind of silly in this case...but that's just my opinion.

" I'm guessing you have a late style case with a type 6 patent plate (model type is suffix to serial number)."

Yes Martin, You're right about the Patent Plate. The model type is suffix to serial number, and not at the bottom of the plate like other models.

I've read and heard about the case differences as well. Can someone post some pics of the Early style case vs. the Late Style case. I just want to verify. The case is most certainly a different base from my Model B Standard case, but it looks like the bedplate lid is identical to the Model B Bedplate lid.

)

Tony K.

Edison Collector/Restorer

Just FYI, Gregg's decals are not the water transfer type. He recommends using Micro Sol and Micro Set solutions (available on ebay).

[martinola]

Hi Tony.

You can find pictures of the various models of Standards here:

http://www.antiquephono.org/spotters-gu ... honograph/

It may take some time for all of the photos to load. This should help you confirm what you have.

Regards,
Martin

[NEFaurora]

Yeah, I've seen that website before, and it's a good one.

Thanks Martin.

)

Tony K.

Edison Collector/Restorer