Victrola No. 4 Performance: Part II

[winsleydale]

Okay, new problems! I just got the No. 4 soundbox in the mail and there are a couple of issues with it: Firstly, the pot metal bezel is cracked behind the needle bar (the crack is tight, probably fresh from when the seller rebuilt it. Would have been nice to know.) The replacement isolator is very loose on the tone arm, which I have noticed is a problem with many modern replacements. Finally, there is something wrong with the thumbscrew, as it hits the inside wall of the chuck and binds before it can properly clamp anything smaller than a loud-tone needle. Finally, it is quite shrill and blasty, and sounds terrible compared to both my Exhibition and No. 2.

The first thing I am gonna do is re-rebuild it with white tubing and new mica and see where that gets me, but I have no clue how to fix the needle bar and stuff. Any suggestions/spares one could part with?

[Damfino59]

Save yourself the pain and suffering and look for a brass #4. Even a HMV brass one. The later HMV #4 had a pot metal back and a brass bezel. Those can be rebuilt if you can get the backplate separated in one piece.

Just mt two cents.

[donniej]

There are solders available for repairing pot metal. I've never used them they do exist.

[winsleydale]

I would love a brass one but I really want to keep the machine all-Victor. If not, I would just leave my Sonora Superfine soundbox in place, which sounds amazing.

I was unaware of the potmetal solder; seems risky to me, but maybe worth a shot.

I realize now that my back plate is warped, probably contributing to the issues. Are there replacements available?

[Damfino59]

Victor did make an all brass #4 early on. I have used one on my wood horn Victor VI for playing early electric recordings.
I am not aware of any re-production back plates.

[winsleydale]

Well I guess I'll keep my eyes peeled for a brass Victor no. 4. In the meantime, I'll do what ai can with this, I guess.

[OrthoFan]

Don't know if this will help you, but here's a Victor #4 sound box brochure -- http://nipperhead.com/old/vic4sb.htm (Click on the thumbnail images to make them full size.)

For the #4 sound box, it's important to pay special attention to the adjustment of the needle arm bearing assembly, illustrated in the second image. If it's too loose, the sound box tends to rattle on certain notes; if too tight, it blasts or sounds shrill.

It's kind of hard to describe how everything fits together in the needle arm bearing assembly, but each bearing support "pivot"--on either side of the needle bar--is held in place by both the lock nut and the end cap screw. Here's a crude drawing showing what I mean:

needlebar.jpg (40.87 KiB) Viewed 2059 times

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Added to my post:


I just looked over your original post string about this sound box. -- http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... =2&t=26819 -- You wrote:

"Mine was about $130 already rebuilt and after shipping. I guess I did well!"

This is just my two cents:

I'd say, for $130, you would have done well if it was in very good structural condition, and played as it should -- without distortion, etc. But, from what you describe, it has not been properly restored.

If you bought this from a shop, or even a private seller who purports to specialize in sound box restoration, you might consider sending it back for a refund, or asking for some consideration, since part of what you paid for was the restoration.

Again, just my opinion.

HTH
OF

[winsleydale]

Yes. I had made that comment before actually receiving the soundbox. Now that I have it, I feel less that way.

HOWEVER.

After realizing the similarity in size, I thought to steal the mica and gasket tubes from my Sonora Superfine and install them in the No. 4. It now sounds far better. Still not quite right, but I know that the Superfine was having issues with that mica, as well. I think it's delaminating.

I'll get new mica for both, and tweak the needle bar pivots on the No. 4 some more.

[winsleydale]

UPDATE: Yesterday, I received some new mica diaphragms from Zwarte Schijf in the Netherlands. I put one into my problematic Victrola No. 4 soundbox, and it now sounds pretty fantastic. Finally, I can claim victory!

Because of weirdness with the needle chuck, I elected to get another one anyways (brass from England this time). But at least I was able to get the sound I wanted.

[Gatyam]

Taker, not giver.