Can anyone identify this make of sound box?

[Viva-Tonal]

It's obviously an after-market product, fitted onto the arm of a friend's Victrola XI:



The aluminium diaphragm suggests it dates from the 1920s and was perhaps intended to make life easier for electrically recorded discs. I didn't get a pic of the other side of it, but there is one small set screw that holds the box onto the arm.

[schweg]

I've seen one like that on a portable, I'm sure it was not a Victor portable but can't remember for sure what "brand".

[OrthoSean]

Yea, Phonola, Walters Conley, Birch. These show up on lots of different portables...

Sean

[gramophoneshane]

I've got one of these. I saw one on ebay a couple yrs back that was NOS in its box, and they were made by Goldring.
Mine doesn't have an aluminium diaphragm though. It looks more like steel as it's getting little rust spots all over it.

[Viva-Tonal]

Thanks for the info! I just assumed the diaphragm was aluminium; I didn't have time to do a good pic or take a closer look. (I had yet to buy the diggie camera I used for the crapophone pix.)

[Henry]

Viva-Tonal, how does it sound on your friend's XI compared to the stock Exhibition or no.2, if you had a chance to hear it?

[gramophoneshane]

Interesting. I wonder if E Toman & Sons shared or sold the design to Goldring in England?
The boxed Goldring example I saw also seemed to suggest that these were available as a separate upgrade, as the box was quite decorative & had a picture of the soundbox on it. I'll have to go through my old CD's & see if I managed to keep a picture of it.
I'm also wondering if the only difference between the Goldring & Toman examples are the diaphagms. As you can see, mine does not have an aluminium diaphagm. Mine also has sold rubber gaskets.

* I've just pulled mine down & at the 12 o'clock position behind the diaphagm, my example has a tiny circle containing an upside down anchor, which would seem to suggest "Thorens" manufacture??

[OrthoFan]

Interesting, Shane, I've never seen one of those sound boxes equipped with a mica diaphragm. Looking carefully at the screws, though, I can see that they were once removed--obviously long ago, if the rust is any indication--by an ill-fitting screw driver. I'm therefore wondering if the original diaphragm might have been replaced with a mica diaphragm? I came across one of these, years ago, in which the original aluminum diaphragm had been replaced by a cut down lid from a tin can!

BTW, I see that some lucky so-n-so got a Goldring Juwel Electro Sound Box (CLICK ME) for next to nothing! I've been told that they are every bit as good, if not a step above, the HMV #4.

[gramophoneshane]

This one has a steel diaphragm, & not mica, but I can assure you it's original. I've only seen 2 others over the years, and both had exactly the same diaphragm.
Presuming this anchor trademark belongs to Thorens, it must have been a Swiss thing to use steel diaphragms because I also have an Apollophone soundbox made by Paillard which also has a steel diaphragm. This one however is made of pot metal, and is of sealed construction so it's impossible to change the diaphragm.
The damage on the screw heads was done by me today when I opened it for the first time, to have a look behind the diaphragm. I seriously doubt this diaphragm has ever been replaced, as it was given to me when I was in high school by another student who found it in a drawer at home.
I just think the Toman version must have used aluminium, and the Thorens/Goldrings used steel?

The Goldring you provided the link to are a little better than the No.4 soundboxes. The diaphragms are ¼" bigger than a No.4, and they have a more volume & clarity. They were made by Paillard, so it appears Goldring were definitely buying their soundboxes from Switzerland. I've got a couple exactly the same, except with different brand names engraved behind the mica- a Portuna Electric, and an Australian Victor.

[OrthoFan]

Hi Shane:

Many thanks. Made me wonder if the one I used to own with the flat metal diaphragm was, indeed, modified. But then, I remember, I took it apart and the metal disc used had obviously been cut by hand with a tin-snips--slightly uneven, jagged edges.

It's odd that they would have used a flat metal diaphragm at a time when the light-weight molded aluminum diaphragms were commonly used throughout the industry; but there may have been a missed shipment, a breakdown at the factory, etc., or this may have been what they had in mind to begin with. Fun to speculate.

While no match for the high quality Victor Orthophonic or Viva Tonal sound boxes, I remember that the one that came with my Birch portable--that one had the aluminum diaphragm--sounded remarkably full after I replaced the original gaskets with silicone, and did some careful tweaking of needle-bar pivot screws.