Original 14" Edison Horns vs. Repros

[MikeB]

Hi -

Are there easy ways to tell the difference between original black and brass 14" Edison horns and reproductions? Sometimes I have trouble telling the difference.

Thanks - Mike

[Dave D]

I look for the bead where the brass bell is joined to the body. Originals have the bead on the outside. Repros have it on the inside.
Dave D

[edisonphonoworks]

Original black and brass usually have a 1905 patent date on them, or PTD stamped into them. As posted above the seam has a roll on the outside of the horn, as opposed to most reproductions that have the seam inside the horn, usually, originals are a little bit taller too!

[phonogfp]

Original black and brass usually have a 1905 patent date on them, or PTD stamped into them.

I respectfully disagree. Many - perhaps most - originals lack patent information.

George P.

[Jerry B.]

I agree with Dave and look for the brass bead on the outside where the brass meets the steel. I also look for a crimped small end although the best reproductions, the Smith's, had a crimped small end. So I look for the bead and a crimped small end.

Jerry B.

[edisonphonoworks]

George, I was only going by the ones I have viewed and ones I own; the black and brass 14" kind. Maybe I have not looked at enough of them.

Original black and brass usually have a 1905 patent date on them, or PTD stamped into them.

I respectfully disagree. Many - perhaps most - originals lack patent information.

George P.

[phonogfp]

Well, this is a topic that seems to resurface every few years. I couldn't find the earlier thread I was looking for, so here's another stab at it...

It's good to keep in mind that original 14" Edison horns were manufactured by 2 or 3 firms, and minor differences are to be expected. By the same token, reproduction 14" horns have been manufactured by several folks over the past 40-odd years, and they range from good to awful.

Click twice on these images to enlarge them.

Here's a picture of a reproduction Edison 14" horn (on the left) and an original (on the right):

Note the larger diameter brass bell on the reproduction. It measures 7 3/16". The original on the right measures 6 15/16". That's a quarter-inch discrepancy.

As noted earlier in this thread, the beaded seam on the original is a more obvious clue.

Here are two reproduction 14" horns. The black & brass repro on the left is the same one as in the previous image. But look at the nickel-plated reproduction on the right. Although its bell diameter is closer to original dimensions (6 13/16"), and it has a beaded seam, look at the way the body and bell curves are misaligned.

Here's a picture that shows it better:

The bell appears to be inserted into the body of the horn, resulting in clumsy appearance (at least, compared to an original's smooth line from body to bell). I'm sure I've seen black & brass repro horns with this same construction, but I don't have any on hand to show.

Don't be misled by the tubular construction of this horn's small oriface. Many original horns were built this way, and I've seen a few original 14" Edison black & brass examples, but not many.

I hope this helps.

George P.

[fmblizz]

Here is a link to an earlier thread with pictures from 2012 that might be of some help. It show's 3 different horns.. actually 4..

Blizz

http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... lit=+horns

[MikeB]

I am posting pictures of 4 horns. Horn #1 is an original, I assume. The other three appear to be of similar construction to George's nickel plated example above. ALL of these horns have smaller bell diameters. #1 bell diameter is 6 ⅞", while the other three all measure 6 ¾". #2 through #4 all have a tubular small end that has been soldered inside the body of the horn, and all have beads, of a sort. The individual horn photos are of horn #2.

So are #2, #3 and #4 repros? What do you think?

Mike

[fmblizz]

yes,,, I believe all three are repro's

blizz