Matrix numbers and recording dates?

[Lucius1958]

Hello:

Just joined this forum, and I have a question on a couple of records I'm uploading to YouTube.

The records in question are Victor black label (Grand Prize), single sided 12 inch, catalog numbers 31382 and 31383, "Tannhäuser Overture - Part ½", played by Pryor's Band.

I'd like to get the correct recording dates for these: the EDVR site gives several, from 1905 to 1907, using the same catalog and matrix numbers. Only Part 2 has the matrix number (C-2412) engraved in the wax. The stickers on the back are dated Feb.1, 1907 (Part 2) , and February 1, 1908 (Part 1).

Looking at the labels, I find that on Part 1, Nipper is cut smaller and less elaborately than on Part 2, with added registration info. Would I be correct in assuming that Part 1 is the 1907 version, while Part 2 is the 1905 recording?

Any further information would be helpful.

[Viva-Tonal]

The very last Grand Prize label did indeed have the Nipper trademark in a slightly smaller size, reasonably dating the year of pressing to 1908 (or late 1907 into 1909).

C.2411-3 dates from 23 May 1906, the last month the matrix number was handwritten just inside the last groove of the recording.

The take digit (when it's shown) can be seen at the 9 o'clock position in the dead wax.

[hillndalefan]

The 9 o'clock position of the take number is correct, but to that needs to be added that the catalogue number has to be in either the 12 o'clock or 6 o'clock position first [both positions were used by Victor--see where the number is right-side up]. The stamper number is usually in the 6 o'clock position and is a letter followed by a number [a 3 is earlier than, say, e 15]. The label style only serves as an indication of the approximate date of the pressing, not the recording. On the single-face records with the sticker on the back, the date at the bottom is only approximate as well, for often old stock was used up and appears on records we know were recorded after the date on the sticker.