Cannibalization of phonographs on EBAY

[fmblizz]

Just curious of what how members feel about cannibalizing perfectly good machine so they can be parted out on Ebay. I'm not talking about part machines but obvious complete machines being disassembled so that even the small screws and bolts are sometimes listed.

I'm sure there are valid arguments for this but greed would seem to be right at the top.

This trend seems to be getting worse every time I do a search.
Below are a few examples..


http://shop.ebay.com/laffy50/m.html

http://shop.ebay.com/schwabs-antiques/m.html

http://shop.ebay.com/neelam/m.html

fmblizz

[Garret]

Simply put, these phonographs do belong to the sellers. Regardless of their greed or misguided intentions, they are generally free to do whatever they wish with it. It doesn't really concern me, to be honest. It is an interesting point to consider.

[martinola]

Cannibalizing solid, complete machines has been on the rise lately. I'd guess due to the economy. Some of these dealers are probably feeling the pinch and realize the only way they'll make a profit (or get their money back), is by parting-out complete machines. Since I've taken to keeping data on Edison Standards four years ago, I've documented several machines that have met this fate. As an enthusiast, I find it sad. On the other hand, without the supply of spare parts I wouldn't have been able to repair the machines I do have. I suspect that some dealers have a greater sensitivity than others. I'd never be a dealer because I'd have a hard time allowing myself to give up on a machine and part it out. So, color me conflicted.

- Martin

[brianu]

there's no conflict with me, sure, they belong to the owner, but I'm one of those people who ascribe to the caretaker camp regarding antiques and historical items... along the same lines as historic properties, sites and houses, in my opinion they've been around far longer than we have and will still be around when we're gone, so any ownership rights or interests we have in these things are far more transient than the things themselves (so I'll only disassemble something for parts if it's really beyond restoration... if I'm unable, or just too lazy, to do it, I'll leave it for someone else). property law - at least in most instances (art and antiquities aside) - typically falls at the other end of the spectrum (owner trumps all), but I'm sure most would agree to the short-sighted, special-interest-serving backwards nature of various components of our legal system... although, to be sure, I think any law that would restrict an owner's right to part out his victrola would be absurd. nevertheless...

you've reminded me of a guy from NJ who for a while - haven't seen much of him lately - bought complete credenzas and parted them out or substituted worse parts (pot metal, for example) for better ones (brass) then resold the re-completed machines (often times overseas) and parted-out ones on ebay. bah.

[alang]

I stumbled across the same listings and had the exact same thoughts. Even though someone might use some of the parts to complete another machine, that machine will be pieced together, while the parted out machine had its own history which will now be lost forever. We may all profit from it now and again, but like Martin I have a hard time giving up on any machine, so I am not happy about this practice.
Andreas

[bbphonoguy]

I'm reminded of the time I was shopping for an "L" door Victrola. I had found a nice early one on ebay, and it was all complete. As I was working on closing the deal (it was a "buy it now" sale) the seller related how he was going to remove the bullet brake to put on another machine of his, but the I could easily find a spare tab brake somewhere to retrofit onto the machine. I told him I was no longer interested, and wound up finding a later machine (1911) that was complete even down to having some of it's original packing material inside of it! It came with every piece of paperwork you could imagine; the unpacking instructions, the products catalog, Columbia and Victor record catalogs from 1911 and 1912, catalog supplements, and more than I can remember right now. It was the same price as the first one too. Glad I waited.

Sorry, that was a long digression.

I don't like parting out any machines. I always feel like something that has survived this long should be taken care of. I also wonder, at what point does a machine stop being original, and simply becomes a "re-creation" constructed out of old parts. I mean, if a machine was not made at the factory, but was made in someone's basement or garage out of extra parts, does it still count as an original machine?

[Jerry B.]

I refuse to do it. Here's how I live my life:

I recently bought a 1965 Schwinn Fiesta because I wanted the optional rack on the bike for another bike. The Fiesta is a girls bike and girls bikes do not have the value of a similar boys bike. Some parts are interchangeable with a boys bike and I could have resold the perfect chrome rims from the girls bike for my entire $40 investment. This is what I did... I completely disassembled the bike and cleaned and polished everything. I cleaned, inspected and re-greased all the bearing. I bought $30 worth of replacement decals. I replaced the front fender light at a cost of $25. I replaced the tires and tubes at a cost of $50. So far I have $145 in the bike and before it's finished, I'll have about ten hours of my time invested. I'll be fortunate to get $200 for the bike but it will look terrific with new white wall tires and new decals and it will ride as well as it did forty seven years ago. It will be a wonderful bike for some lucky lady. I'm sure I'll do it again. Jerry B.

[Brad]

I don't agree with it either, however, one wonders (ignoring exact configurations) how many machines become "whole" due to the one sacrifice?

One VV-XI dies so that seven more can live!

[Skihawx]

At one time I had two Victor VE 9-40's. Both were early two door models.
Both were restored. One was in very nice condition and the other one came from the
estate of a Victor executive and was the first serial number 501. I wanted
to keep the nicer one but would not even think of switching the ID tag. Not
because of value but more because it was not the first one and I would know
it. But I had no problem parting out a third VE 9-40 that was pretty much
complete but just in very rough shape. Sometimes there are just too many
of a certain item to find an interested collector. Right now there seems to be way
more Edison standards that there are collectors. And this situation is only
going to get worse as large collections are sold and the internet brings more on the
market. I've got a rough two door credenza now. Should I try to sell it for $300.00
or part it out? It is not like there isn't a Credenza on ebay every week for someone
that really wanted one.

[Valecnik]

What others do is thier business I guess but I don't do it. I keep my machines together and if I do sell, never switch parts before selling. The reproducer that came with it is the one that leaves with it, even if a machine in my collection has a poorer quality reproducer as a result.

The one exception is where it's obviously already been done and I know it's been done.