Miniature Thorn Needle compared to BCN through microscope

[IainP1]

Another day, another photo-microscopy experiment... I was surprised how much detail is visible in this HMV Miniature Thorn Needle for lightweight pickups, as it's so much smaller than a BCN at only 1mm thick at most. The comparison of the two is interesting too.
Is it possible to put a date range on the miniature thorns?
Iain

[Orchorsol]

Thanks yet again Iain, fascinating!

It's interesting that the HMV is clearly from the same species of cactus. As miniature thorns didn't come in until the late 1940s or 50s this strengthens my view that one operation made thorn needles for multiple brands (already there are indications that BCN and IM thorn needles were made by the same facility at least towards the end). At some time - I'm fairly certain in the 1930s though not confirmed - BCN had approached the Royal Botanic Gardens at Kew for help to find a new source of thorns of the same species in the right growing conditions. That turned out to be the island of Saint Helena in the mid Atlantic. I doubt that HMV would have set up their own separate supply!

[IainP1]

Thanks yet again Iain, fascinating!

It's interesting that the HMV is clearly from the same species of cactus. As miniature thorns didn't come in until the late 1940s or 50s this strengthens my view that one operation made thorn needles for multiple brands (already there are indications that BCN and IM thorn needles were made by the same facility at least towards the end). At some time - I'm fairly certain in the 1930s though not confirmed - BCN had approached the Royal Botanic Gardens at Kew for help to find a new source of thorns of the same species in the right growing conditions. That turned out to be the island of Saint Helena in the mid Atlantic. I doubt that HMV would have set up their own separate supply!

And thanks for that fascinating information too! For some reason I was expecting the smaller needle to have smaller cells, but you say, they appear the same. It's amazing they are in such good condition, considering their age, and the colour has survived so well, especially the part that was pushed into the holder so not exposed to the air. The needles have an interesting "bulging" shape too, which is not apparent till you get them under the microscope. I'll be looking out for other similar ones to add to the collection and get them under the 'scope too
Iain

[Orchorsol]

I'll have a rummage and see what I can find to send you as samples. I should have some IM (Imhofs) thorns, possibly two different types, and maybe a few others.

And then there's triangular section bamboo fibre needles if you're interested...

[IainP1]

I'll have a rummage and see what I can find to send you as samples. I should have some IM (Imhofs) thorns, possibly two different types, and maybe a few others.

And then there's triangular section bamboo fibre needles if you're interested...

Gosh, that's very kind. Thank you! I'll PM you shortly re address and stuff (it's been a long time since I bought the BCNs from you . I have one set of triangular thorns, so may not need one of those if it's the same. I'll send a close up photo too.
All the best, Iain

[Orchorsol]

I'll have a rummage and see what I can find to send you as samples. I should have some IM (Imhofs) thorns, possibly two different types, and maybe a few others.

And then there's triangular section bamboo fibre needles if you're interested...

Gosh, that's very kind. Thank you! I'll PM you shortly re address and stuff (it's been a long time since I bought the BCNs from you . I have one set of triangular thorns, so may not need one of those if it's the same. I'll send a close up photo too.
All the best, Iain

I just had a delve into my collection of non-metallic needles (larger than I thought, ha ha) and unfortunately it's going to take quite some time! I need to sort out incomplete/duplicate packs etc. But I should have a few I can send you soon

[IainP1]

I'll have a rummage and see what I can find to send you as samples. I should have some IM (Imhofs) thorns, possibly two different types, and maybe a few others.

And then there's triangular section bamboo fibre needles if you're interested...

Gosh, that's very kind. Thank you! I'll PM you shortly re address and stuff (it's been a long time since I bought the BCNs from you . I have one set of triangular thorns, so may not need one of those if it's the same. I'll send a close up photo too.
All the best, Iain

I just had a delve into my collection of non-metallic needles (larger than I thought, ha ha) and unfortunately it's going to take quite some time! I need to sort out incomplete/duplicate packs etc. But I should have a few I can send you soon

Any needle, anytime, would be very gratefully received and given the full Micro Treatment! Here's the one kind of bamboo I have, which looks like it's worth putting under the scope too, before and after a play.

[Roaring20s]

Incredible views! Thanks for doing this.

James.

[Hoodoo]

Very nice to see all these super close-up images, thank you for posting them.
I have seen pictures of electrical pickups from the 1940s, or maybe they were even from the 1950s, that used steel needles held in with a thumbscrew. Would those be the kind of pickups the tiny thorn needles would be used in and if so, would they also have also been used to play LPs?

[Orchorsol]

Very nice to see all these super close-up images, thank you for posting them.
I have seen pictures of electrical pickups from the 1940s, or maybe they were even from the 1950s, that used steel needles held in with a thumbscrew. Would those be the kind of pickups the tiny thorn needles would be used in and if so, would they also have also been used to play LPs?

Yes. Many of them, probably the great majority of such pickups (earlier types) would take full sized thorn needles, whereas most of those form the late 40s or 50s would only fit miniature thorns.

I don't make miniature BCN thorns myself (it's possible but very labour intensive indeed), however I do keep various new-old-stock types.