Advice Needed on Adjusting an Edison C-250

[Couch Potato]

I recently acquired a nice Edison C-250. I have come to notice the reproducer is rotated a bit as you can see in the below photos. It is that way even with other reproducers so I know it's the horn collar that is not quite aligned properly and am wondering how it might be brought back so it is more parallel to the platter/record. Has anyone else ever faced this issue and if so what steps did you take to improve it? Or perhaps I simply need to leave well enough alone. Thoughts?

[drh]

The collar that secures the reproducer, circled in red in the photo below, is not in its locked position. You should start by rotating it until the pin marked with the blue arrow is all the way to the top of the slot, in the position marked with the green arrow. That may clear the discrepancy up by itself. Even if not, I suspect a 1/16" discrepancy will not make any significant difference in play, although others may have a different view on that question.

[Couch Potato]

Well, thank you that is a good advice and an excellent reminder which led me take more observations.

The horn collar of course has a slot that the pin on the reproducer slides into and that slot actually affords some degree of rotation both clockwise (the direction I wish to rotate), and counter-clockwise (the direction I don't want to go). Based on you suggestion I carefully checked again by sliding the reproducer in and rotated it as far clockwise as the slot would allow and it evens out like I wish for since the slot in the horn collar affords that degree of "play" to do so with.

I think the fly in the ointment is that when you then go to tighten the collar down to secure the reproducer it naturally forces the reproducer back in the ill desired counter-clockwise direction and at that point the "play" in the slot works to my disadvantage!

It may be best for me to simply try to apply torque to the reproducer in the clockwise direction when tightening the collar in the opposite direction, hopefully with the result that the reproducer does not get tugged along with the collar in the same in the wrong direction. It seems to me that when you normally tighten the collar the reproducer pin ends up being forced down on the bottom of the slot and I wish for it in my case to remain at the top which the design of the collar works against.

If anyone else has a word of advice it would be welcome.

The other thing with this machine is I know how to lower and raise the horn assembly to adjust where the stylus bar rides in the reproducer loop. In my case I need to lower the horn assembly to adjust the stylus but there isn't much lower I can go before the horn will drag on the cabinet. I think my best course of action to counter act that is to simply to shim up the bedplate with felt or rubber as dyslexic genius recommends in one of his videos.

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[Inigo]

May I have read somewhere that you can also raise the position of the horn in the rotating axle? Kind of everything is indeed adjustable in the horn shaft... Or am I wrong?

[Damfino59]

This may help:

viewtopic.php?t=476

[JerryVan]

On what are basing the need to set the stylus lower? Is there some dimension you're trying to achieve, or are you looking for a position that you "feel" is correct? Unless something has been damaged in the past, you should have the ability adjust things properly without dragging the horn on the cabinet. The link that Damfino59 posted is an excellent one!

As to the 1/16" "twist", I do not believe this is an issue worth persuing. Actually, the position of the reproducer body is really not as important as the the position of the floating weight, since that where the stylus bar mounts.

[Couch Potato]

Well, my concern is the reproducer is just tilted a bit and not really in the same plane as the platter when viewed from the front (as seen in the original pictures). I have 4 other DD Machines and the reproducer on this one is the first of them to exhibit this. I am use to Edison stuff being built like tanks and pretty consistent so was surprised by this. As others have mentioned it may not make that much difference so perhaps I should not be concerned but given it's a nice machine I am hoping to make it better. I also realize I can probably file the horn collar slot to allow more play for the reproducer pin to rotate to where I want it.

In looking at the post (not the rods that go into it at either end) I do seem to notice that the upper collar that holds the top of the horn to the post may not be in its original position. Was this collar welded to the posts originally or press fit, or is that the purpose of one of the set screws to hold it to the post to begin with? Or do both set screws simply go through and press the rod that extends up to the lifting lever to hold it in place?

How the horn is held at top and bottom of the post and any twist along that axis I would think would influence greatly where and how the reproducer collar would resultingly end up being positioned.

I am more than familiar and clear with lowering and an lifting the horn using the hole on the bottom rod to make that adjustments though in my case. In the down position I don't have really any more down to go otherwise the horn will drag on the wood bottom!

I am just curious how they might have attached the horn to the post originally and if they were simply fixed in place or if there was some semblance of adjustability to the horn because it would seem that would have had to be done rather precisely in order to get the reproducer end of it to end up accurately positioned and do so with repeatability every time.

[JerryVan]

Was this collar welded to the posts originally or press fit, or is that the purpose of one of the set screws to hold it to the post to begin with?

The set screws are what lock & hold the horn mount to the vertical rod.

You state that the bottom mount appears to be in its original location, while the upper appears to be elevated. Considering that the horn is just sheet metal, it may be possible to adjust the upper mount only, by compressing the horn opening as needed to reposition the upper mount. You may also explore the possibility of rotating the upper mount relative to the lower mount. This may introduce enough twist to the horn to aid in correcting the slant of your reproducer. It will likely take some force to accomplish both moves but should not be harmful to give it a try, (if done within reason).

[Couch Potato]

Jerry, thank you for your reply. I take it from your comments that the outside clamp is moveable and likely rotatable to some extent once the two set screw are removed or loosened sufficiently. If moved down some it would squish the horn a little bit making it a little bit wider and a little bit shorter, it would also likely allow that clamp to rotate a little one way or the other which would also torque the horn a bit, both of which may make the horn neck move around perhaps for the better. So, I think I am comfortable giving some more things a try based on your feedback.

I moved this machine about 200 miles by SUV on its back recently so it received its fair share of bumps and vibrations on the journey. I have it in my garage and cooler weather is almost here so I will very soon have the opportunity to work on it a length.

Always curious how they built these things at scale and got everything to work out so accurately on the factory floor and that horn and the way it is mounted to the post appears to have many variables conceivably at play.

[Lucius1958]

Q: Where does the limit pin sit when the stylus is on the record? Should be halfway up the loop.

As for the reproducer: the Edison manual suggests gently bending the horn neck up or down. That could possibly solve both issues.

- Bill