Please help! WTB an Edison Standard or Home mostly original.

[russco23513]

Hi folks. I'm new to this, and fell in love with these old phonographs at Gaslight Village in upstate NY when I was a kid. I would like to get one in original condition, but need y'all experts advice so I don't get taken! I love the early models with those awesome banners on the base, so I guess I'm looking at the 2 minute model B players? I understand the Edison Home players originally cost a bit more than the Standards. Were they made much better? -Is either one more reliable than the other? What should I be looking for to make sure the player has an original decal,reproducer,crank,pinstriping, etc. since there are so many repros out there? -Who are some of the more honest & reputable dealers?Anybody seen any really decent mostly original players lately (ebay perhaps)? -How much approx. should I expect to spend for good original working Standard or Home phonograph? Thanks very much folks. I really do appreciate any help and advice you knowledgable people have to offer! I hope you all have a blessed day!
Russ

[Lucius1958]

Hi: I understand your enthusiasm...

Most "banner" Edisons are Model As, though some of the very early Model B machines still had the older style decal. As far as the difference between Homes and Standards, they were both well made.

The board has some links to dealers, suppliers and repairers; but the best way to get a machine is to see them up close and personal. That way, you can examine the condition of the case, motor, etc. You might also read up on the various models, so you can familiarize yourself with what's generally "correct" for each type. (That said, many earlier Edisons were often upgraded by their owners with newer reproducers, 2/4 minute gearing, Cygnet horns and the like).

Some things you might want to check are the reproducers - generally, originals will have a serial number stamped on them - and horns (there is a good thread here on repro vs. original). Overall, you'll be able, with a little experience, to tell if a piece has been refinished, or has a repro decal.

As for prices, it depends on whom you're dealing with: but Homes and Standards are pretty common machines, and shouldn't cost you more than a few hundred, depending on condition. (your mileage may vary).

I hope this has been of some help to you in your quest: Welcome aboard!

Bill

[Jerry B.]

If you want one good machine and like the banner decals, buy a Edison Standard B with the banner decal. The earlier B series of Standards and Homes had the banner decal and later B's had just the "Edison" decal. I'd also suggest one that also has the four minute gearing. When Edison came out with four minute cylinders, one of the first things he did was make additional gearing available for the machines that were only two minute players. All "B" series machine started out as a two minute only players but many were converted to play both two and four minute records. My preference between a Home and Standard is the Edison Standard but both are fine machines and quite common. When you are out antiquing and find a great cylinder, chances are very high that the record will play on your two and four minute player. Jerry Blais

[antique1973]

Standards with 2-4 min gearing are great. If you have the right reproducers you can play
pretty much any cylinder.

[brianu]

As for prices, it depends on whom you're dealing with: but Homes and Standards are pretty common machines, and shouldn't cost you more than a few hundred, depending on condition. (your mileage may vary).

I agree with pretty much all you wrote, except for the comment on prices. even after reading a lot of (low) value-related comments on this board, I still hesitate to ask when so many people became so cheap... mainly because I think it can more accurately be said that some have just become spoiled by their ability, after spending enough time collecting and developing useful practices for doing so, to find extremely good deals, whether through auctions, estate or garage sales, etc... and that can be a good thing, but those figures at the low end really shouldn't be used to gauge the general value of things or provide realistic estimates to people looking for advice in buying something. I once found a victor XX for about 800 bucks. we all have our stories, but who would use that figure in responding to someone who's trying to determine how much they should generally expect to pay for such a machine?

I think a basic edison cylinder machine, a standard or a home (based on pricing at shows, auctions, ebay and various private sales I've seen), can surely be found at the very low end around a few hundred bucks. but generally I think - depending on condition and accessories, whether it's a 2 or 2 and 4 minute machine, etc. - someone looking to buy one should more reasonably expect to pay at least 400, but more like 500 to 600, or more if there's a crane and large horn... and especically so if restoration has also been done on the motor and/or reproducer.

[SonnyPhono]

I agree with everyone's suggestions regarding what to consider when making a decision to buy a Standard or Home. As for what you should expect to pay, I agree with Lucius1958 in that a nice Standard or Home can be found for a couple hundred dollars.

I still hesitate to ask when so many people became so cheap...

I think assuming someone is cheap based on comments made regarding prices they have paid for phonographs is silly. (Provided they didn't try to haggle down an already low price with an inexperienced seller.)

My first cylinder player I ever owned was a Standard. It was missing the lid, had a reproduction horn, a badly applied repro decal, and was missing the stylus bar on the reproducer. I bought it on eBay because I didn't want to wait so ended up paying $350 for it. Here it is:

Since then, I have found that with plenty of searching, time and patience, better phonographs can be found at better prices. I paid less than $200 for each of the following phonographs and didn't haggle with any of the sellers regarding their asking price.

Finding and buying these phonographs for good prices doesn't mean I am cheap or that I have been spoiled regarding my thoughts on their general value. Everyone has different means to invest in this hobby and mine is limited at this point in my life due to my age and having 2 young kids with a third due any day now. So finding good deals simply allows me to enjoy the hobby with what limited funds I am able to put into it.

Russ, if you would like to find something sooner rather than later, I agree with Brian in that it may be more realistic to expect to pay $400 or more. But if you aren't in a hurry or don't want to spend that kind of money, you will probably be able to find a nice Home or Standard for half that price with some searching and time. Either way, welcome to the hobby!

[Jerry B.]

Sonny, That's as fine a group of under $200 machines as I've ever seen in forty plus years of collecting. It's even better if they all came with their correct horns, cranes, and bright finishes. If you personally spent a fair amount of time to clean, polish, and make minor adjustments it makes things a little different. Perhaps that's where there is a difference of opinion with this thread. If a first time buyer enjoys the challenge of bringing a machine back to good running order, a price of around $200 might not be out of line. If another first time buyer wants a machine ready to use without any effort, it would be a much more difficult search to find one for $200. I think we are trying to compare apples with oranges. With respect, Jerry Blais

[Jerry B.]

Here's another way to visually make an explanation. I bought this record cabinet for $400. After several hour of my effort and maybe $25 in materials, the second photo is the end result. Is it still a $400 cabinet?

[brianu]

that's really the point I was trying to make. great deals can always be found if you wait long enough or look hard enough, but the question wasn't "what's the cheapest price for which I could find this machine," it was "how much should I expect to spend" for a "good original working" machine, specifically a basic edison cylinder player.

I remember some of the machines shown in the photos above when they were posted and discussed before. they're pretty much all "after" photos (as opposed to shots of what they looked like when first purchased), right? either way, those are indisuptably great finds and great buys for 200 or less. but they're great finds/buys at that price for a reason, because those models typically cost a good deal more than that when they're found.

[SonnyPhono]

If you personally spent a fair amount of time to clean, polish, and make minor adjustments it makes things a little different. Perhaps that's where there is a difference of opinion with this thread. If a first time buyer enjoys the challenge of bringing a machine back to good running order, a price of around $200 might not be out of line. If another first time buyer wants a machine ready to use without any effort, it would be a much more difficult search to find one for $200. I think we are trying to compare apples with oranges.

This is a good point that I really didn't consider when posting my thoughts about price. I have loved working on phonographs to bring them back as close to original as possible ever since I started into the hobby. You are right. Comparing values of these machines in the state that I find them in as opposed to how they turn out when all the work is done is like comparing apples to oranges.

I remember some of the machines shown in the photos above when they were posted and discussed before. they're pretty much all "after" photos (as opposed to shots of what they looked like when first purchased), right?

Yes, those were mostly "after" photos. Glad you brought this point up as there was a lot of work done to these. After thinking about it, I should have added a before/during picture so people don't think I found those machines in such good condition. For example, here is a "before" and "during" picture of the Home in the first picture of my prior post.

Completely disassembled, cleaned...

Then rebuilt and properly adjusted.

There is definitely something to be said for the value of time and effort taken to restore a phonograph, regardless of how low the initial purchase price.