how to sort through a couple of hundred records?

[jdc]

I picked up a couple of hundred records, dating from approximately 1910 to 1950, and from many different labels. I own a Cecilian phonograph from around 1920 or so, which uses the standard steel needles, and I understand that I'm only supposed to play older records on it (before about 1935), as later records can get damaged.

My main question is whether there is a quick way to determine which records are the appropriate kind. I've been trying to search for each record online, but many are hard to find, and even the ones I find often don't list years. Any suggestions for how I can make this process more efficient?

I'm most interested in answers that will help me in general, but as just one example of the trouble I've had, I've got one record that I've seen conflicting dates for: His Master's Voice, B.8741, The Stately Homes of England("Operette") (Noel Coward), Hugh French, Ross Landon, John Gatrell, Kenneth Carten, ...

A side question: some of the records are broken. Are these generally garbage, or would there be some reason to keep them?

Thanks for any help!

[kirtley2012]

basically if they look older then they usually are older, if they look newer they usually are newer! you will get better at approximately dating records with time! i can usually look at a record and guess its aproximate date!

as for the broken ones, garbage, however i do sometimes cut/drill the labels out on broken records and you can then use them as cup mats or just for decoration!

[jdc]

basically if they look older then they usually are older, if they look newer they usually are newer!

Hmm, I have some His Master's Voice records that look quite similar, but have dates ranging from 1913 to 1941. And if I understand correctly, I shouldn't play the 1941 record. So, at least until I get better at this, just going by looks isn't going to be enough.

Any other suggestions?

[HisMastersVoice]

A good rule to follow is that acoustic discs usually do not have a lead in groove. There are of course many exceptions to this, however.

[jdc]

A good rule to follow is that acoustic discs usually do not have a lead in groove. There are of course many exceptions to this, however.

Thanks, that will be helpful.

By the way, beside your post it mentioned Pathé disks, and I got about a dozen of those, but the sleeves say they need a special needle. Can anyone tell me more about this?

Thanks!

[VintageTechnologies]

A good rule to follow is that acoustic discs usually do not have a lead in groove. There are of course many exceptions to this, however.

Thanks, that will be helpful.

By the way, beside your post it mentioned Pathé disks, and I got about a dozen of those, but the sleeves say they need a special needle. Can anyone tell me more about this?

Thanks!

Some Pathé records such as yours require a sapphire tipped needle to play. That needle looks like a metal shank with a clear round ball on the tip; usually the metal shank is gold colored. The American-made Pathé records had a black label with a red rooster and played at 80rpm; I assume that is what yours look like. Never use a steel needle, it will chew them up! Those special records also had be played on a machine that was designed to play vertical-cut records (Pathé and some Brunswicks, for example). Pathé later sold Pathé Actuelle records, which were conventional 78rpm records.

[gramophoneshane]

When playing Pathé records, you would also need to turn the soundbox of your Cecilian to play them, as shown below. This is a different brand of machine, but the principle will be the same.
Personally, I dont worry about only playing pre-1935 records on my machines. I play them all with steel needles except for those made from various plastics, and have done for 30 years, and the only ones I've worn out are the ones I've played literally 100s of times.

As the records that came with your machine shows, people who owned wind-up gramophones didn't suddenly stop buying records in 1935. They kept buying & playing records until production stopped in the late 50s, and I dont imagine any of your post 1935 records are worn out?
I think it's more important that your soundbox has new gaskets & the tonearm moves freely, than what year the record was made.

[FloridaClay]

Edison and Pathé, mostly (there were a few other minor players), were the champions of vertical cut records; that is, the needle moves up and down in the grove rather than side-to-side. This system eventually died out and was pretty much gone by the late 1920s. IMHO that is unfortunate, because I think they sound better, but that is life I guess. Another advantage is that most of the vertical cut reproducers had diamond or sapphire needles that did not have to be changed after playing every record, as is the case with the steel needles common to lateral cut record reproduces for decades.

Except for those labeled as Actuelle, which are lateral cut records, you should never play Pathé records on an ordinary phonograph designed for lateral cut records. You will ruin them! There were a few makes of phonographs that came out during the transition period that would play either vertical or lateral cut records— Brunswick's Ultona system, for example.

One clue as to whether a machine can play vertical cuts is that the reproducer either is, or is designed to be shifted to, play with the plane of the diaphragm perpendicular to the record grove, so the example in your illustration could be one. Here is a pic of a Pathé with its vertical cut reproducer.

Pathé vertical cut records are a world unto themselves. There were all sorts of odd sizes and, until things finally settled down to 80 RPM, strange speeds. As I think somebody here has suggested though, if they are Pathé’s with the paper labels with the red rooster, they are probably 80s.

Clay