Some direction with 78s

[m0xiemama]

So, everyone has given me a great list of books to pick up as phonograph references but are there some must read publications about 78s.
I must admit that I am slightly overwhelmed by the vastness of the market. Right now I just have the collections people throw in when you buy their phonograph and a few cheap lots I bought from ebay. I really like the bound sets like Al Jolson, Glenn Miller, Dorsey etc but I am pretty sure they are later than they should be. So what should I be looking for???

[Wolfe]

Do ya like music? I'm not sure some people in this 'hobby' do.

But if you like certain music that you find on 78's. Just buy that.

No other reason, unless you want to be some a**hole e-bay flipper, out to try to make a big buck.

[m0xiemama]

Do ya like music? I'm not sure some people in this 'hobby' do.

But if you like certain music that you find on 78's. Just buy that.

No other reason, unless you want to be some a**hole e-bay flipper, out to try to make a big buck.

Yeah I do like music but I hear so often how if you play the 78s that are later than the 20s they get ruined. I definitely am not looking to make money off selling them but I surely would hate to think I was ruining good music. I have been buying a bunch of those 4disc smart sets because it is music I enjoy and just playing them with discretion.

[Wolfe]

Do ya like music? I'm not sure some people in this 'hobby' do.

But if you like certain music that you find on 78's. Just buy that.

No other reason, unless you want to be some a**hole e-bay flipper, out to try to make a big buck.

Yeah I do like music but I hear so often how if you play the 78s that are later than the 20s they get ruined. I definitely am not looking to make money off selling them but I surely would hate to think I was ruining good music. I have been buying a bunch of those 4disc smart sets because it is music I enjoy and just playing them with discretion.

Virtually any album set of 10" inch records should be played with discretion (that is with a fairly light weight tonearm) because they were really meant to be played on electric record players. It's a pretty easy demarcation point. Without even having to put an exact date on when the music was recorded.

Or if you want to play them on your acoustic phono, use a soft thorn needle.

[Bob E.]

One or two things you can do online to educate yourself:

1) Poke around on the Online 78 RPM Discographical Project:

http://www.78discography.com/

to find which labels may have artists and titles that interest you, in the time period you want. This website is also highly useful for dating records in your collection. You can then do some searching for information about the company to find out what the earlier vs. later labels look like (for example, check out Wikipedia's entry for Vocalion Records). There are some galleries of label images on Nauck's auction site as well:

http://www.78rpm.com/

Now you know what records to focus on when flipping through a stack at a flea market or swap meet. You'll develop a "feel" for the appearance of older labels in general, and then can make a judgement call about the content or at least the genre by the name of the artist and song title, as well as other information that may be on the label.

2) Scan through the offerings on eBay, looking for a knowledgeable seller, not necessarily to buy from, but to learn from. Some folks are very verbose about the records they are offering, and can be a wealth of information. This was how I discovered the 78 RPM Discographical Project in the first place, by asking a knowledgeable seller!

Good luck, the search is easily half the fun!

--Bob

[FloridaClay]

OK Moxie, here comes one of the dichotomies that creep in to every discussion. Broadly speaking their seem to be 2 camps of record collectors (and yes there is overlap, of course). For one group it is all about records as objects—the thrill for them seems to be finding that next extremely rare recording in pristine condition. They might find some rara avis and seldom, or never, play it. For the other camp it is primarily about the music. They buy records because hearing them brings pleasure.

Both camps are equally valid. Just depends on where your main interests are. Personally I am about 95% in the second camp. The way I started, and am really still on that journey, is to buy stacks of old 78s at yard sales and thrift shops. Not knowing all that much about the scope of what was out there for the first half of the 20th century, this was/is a great way to learn. I found there were things I really came to love (20s jazz for example) and, like some of the folks here on the Forum who have developed an allergy to Hawaiian music, other things I would not touch with that proverbial 10’ pole (I doubt if I will ever be crazy about polkas and string bands--but have kept some of those to play for guests who like them). This helps me refine my search as time goes on and the range of what I buy has become much narrower. I also learned what things to by pass because of condition. Look carefully for cracks and gray groves are not good. (Although it can sometimes be surprising how good a record can sound when you wash off the grime.)

Another thing to realize is that when it comes to records that were really popular when they came out, they are as common as dirt. For example, there was a time when one in four records on juke boxes in the US were by Glenn Miller. More than 100,000 copies of his Tuxedo Junction were sold in the first week! A decent copy now might be worth a buck on a good day. So I do not agonize about playing big band records on my Credenza. Great music, but they are as common and most of my copies are only in average condition anyhow. And incidentally, so far if any harm being done I can not detect it. (When I play 40s records on an acoustic I always use a soft tone needle. They flex more and are gentler.) Of course if I came across a NOS unplayed album set, I would only play it on a modern phonograph—if at all—and play my common copies on my acoustic phonographs instead.

So I guess my recommendation would be not to let the tale wag the dog. The hobby is all about the joy it brings. Of course keep your records stored properly, keep them clean, change those needles with every record, but above all enjoy!

Now climbing down off soap box.

Clay

[52089]

So, everyone has given me a great list of books to pick up as phonograph references but are there some must read publications about 78s.
I must admit that I am slightly overwhelmed by the vastness of the market. Right now I just have the collections people throw in when you buy their phonograph and a few cheap lots I bought from ebay. I really like the bound sets like Al Jolson, Glenn Miller, Dorsey etc but I am pretty sure they are later than they should be. So what should I be looking for???

One recommended read would be the Collector's Guide to Victor Records by Michael Sherman. It goes over the general history of Victor records, the various eras and label types, specialized pressings, etc. You'll learn, for example, that the "ring" style labels started in 1937 and as such may be a bit "late" for use on your Orthophonic. You'll also learn how to spot electric recordings on the (generally) acoustic "bat wing" label. Not a cheap book, but well researched and full of good information.

[Wolfe]

Both camps are equally valid. Just depends on where your main interests are. Personally I am about 95% in the second camp. The way I started, and am really still on that journey, is to buy stacks of old 78s at yard sales and thrift shops.

Good advice, especially if you happen to live in an older city. So many cheap 78's are still out there, you can really clean up. A few bucks in hand may net you 12-15 records, so experiment and have fun!

You can always refer here for more specific questions. There are a number of very informed 78 (and cylinder) collectors who lurk here.

[m0xiemama]

Thanks guys. Very helpful.