My latest addition--a Pathéphone No. 120

[drh]

I've just added a new phono to the phlock: a Pathéphone no. 120. I bought it from an eBay seller in France, had it shipped directly to Brett Hurt (about a day's drive away from my home in the DC suburbs) for overhaul/restoration, and then went down to collect it a couple of weeks ago. Putting it into service had to wait, though, until he finished fabricating a second crank to enable it to play 20" discs with a touchup winding as needed. Last night was its debut, and I'm happy to report it's a success.

[JerryVan]

Beautiful!!

[Roaring20s]

A graceful phonograph that complements the flamboyance of flamingos!

James.

[Viva-voce]

Absolutely lovely machine. Congrats!

Steven

[tictalk]

Congratulations, Very nice-looking machine, we have recently started to add a few European machines to our collection, much more flamboyant designs than most of the American machines.

[CarlosV]

Congratulations, it is a very good-looking machine! I have its predecessor, the nr 12, which is very similar but not identical. Both were designed to play up to the 50 cm sized records, with the large back bracket, the longer crank and an adjustable speed up to 120 rpm, which is the approximate speed of the 50 cm recordings.

[edisonplayer]

It looks like a 20 inch Pathé on the turntable,I may be wrong.edisonplayer.

[drh]

Thanks, everyone, for the kind words! I'm thrilled to have it in good running order, and it sounds very nice.

Congratulations, it is a very good-looking machine! I have its predecessor, the nr 12, which is very similar but not identical. Both were designed to play up to the 50 cm sized records, with the large back bracket, the longer crank and an adjustable speed up to 120 rpm, which is the approximate speed of the 50 cm recordings.

Do you have any more information about the 120, like the rough time when it was on the market, where it stood in the overall Pathé line, and so on? Information about the European Pathé machines is mighty scarce in this country. Information about the US machines isn't that extensive, either, when you get down to it.

It looks like a 20 inch Pathé on the turntable,I may be wrong.edisonplayer.

It is indeed in the first photo; the rest are 14". I have two of the 20" ones, both etched label center-start discs. They weigh a *lot*, and with all that mass swirling around at 120 RPM or so, the machine and its supporting table need to be well braced if they aren't to Shimmy Like my Sister Kate. I think they may also account for that idiosyncratic lever start mechanism found on Pathé's outside horn machines: the 20" records are so heavy that the motor needs a push to get going.

[CarlosV]

Do you have any more information about the 120, like the rough time when it was on the market, where it stood in the overall Pathé line, and so on? Information about the European Pathé machines is mighty scarce in this country. Information about the US machines isn't that extensive, either, when you get down to it.

Unfortunately the scarcity of information about Pathé is not confined to the US, even in France there are no systematic sources, nor any real research has been made. From what I can tell, the first disc machines appeared in the 1906 catalogue, and they were named Pathé with letters - Pathé A, B etc. Some years later they came with new models and renamed them Pathéphone with one and two digit numbers: Pathéphone 8, 12, 14, 18. The 1914 catalogue - see the attachment - shows the Pathéphone with the three digit names, specifically the 120 and the 180, but these were not new machines, but more or less the same as their two-digit counterparts 12 and 18, and they were advertised together with the older nr 2 and nr 4 - that were not renamed 20 and 40. I have the 18 and the 180, and the main difference between both is the motor, a more sturdy square motor on the 18 and a lighter (cheaper?) triangular motor on the 180. There are some differences on the exterior, like the speed control (a change driven by the different motors), the name tag of both 18 and 180 is made of brass, but the 12 tag is made of brass and the photo of yours shows what appears to be a decal. Maybe the motor of the 12 - see photo - was also replaced on the 120, you can check that. It seems that renaming was a tentative to extend the commercial lives of their external horn machines, that by that time were being replaced with the reflex models.

As to where the Pathéphone 12 (and its successor the 120) stood in the product line, there were two models above it, the 14 and the 18. The nr 14 is an extremely rare de-luxe model - I saw only one in a collection, and the owner would not sell it to me - and the 18, which is not common but not exactly rare, and is the largest of that line.

[drh]

Unfortunately the scarcity of information about Pathé is not confined to the US, even in France there are no systematic sources, nor any real research has been made. From what I can tell, the first disc machines appeared in the 1906 catalogue, and they were named Pathé with letters - Pathé A, B etc. Some years later they came with new models and renamed them Pathéphone with one and two digit numbers: Pathéphone 8, 12, 14, 18. The 1914 catalogue - see the attachment - shows the Pathéphone with the three digit names, specifically the 120 and the 180, but these were not new machines, but more or less the same as their two-digit counterparts 12 and 18, and they were advertised together with the older nr 2 and nr 4 - that were not renamed 20 and 40. I have the 18 and the 180, and the main difference between both is the motor, a more sturdy square motor on the 18 and a lighter (cheaper?) triangular motor on the 180. There are some differences on the exterior, like the speed control (a change driven by the different motors), the name tag of both 18 and 180 is made of brass, but the 12 tag is made of brass and the photo of yours shows what appears to be a decal. Maybe the motor of the 12 - see photo - was also replaced on the 120, you can check that. It seems that renaming was a tentative to extend the commercial lives of their external horn machines, that by that time were being replaced with the reflex models.

As to where the Pathéphone 12 (and its successor the 120) stood in the product line, there were two models above it, the 14 and the 18. The nr 14 is an extremely rare de-luxe model - I saw only one in a collection, and the owner would not sell it to me - and the 18, which is not common but not exactly rare, and is the largest of that line.

Many, many thanks! That's all very helpful, and I'm more than delighted to have the catalogue showing my machine. All that is the sort of information that simply doesn't seem to exist on this side of the Atlantic--not surprising, I guess, considering that Pathé didn't really sell open-horn machines here.

Yes, you're right, the model tag on my 120 is a decal, and there's no further Pathé decal, like the guy hurling a record like a discus as there is on my Concert 20. Interesting about the motors. Here's a photo of the motor in the 120, taken from the eBay listing (it's much cleaner now, after having received the restorer's ministrations). I found some photos of a 180 for sale in Switzerland, and it appears to have the same one, so I'm guessing it's the same as in your 180. By the way, from the Swiss listing, the 180 is a handsome machine, and I'd love to see some photos of yours.

motor (from eBay listing).jpg (169.29 KiB) Viewed 708 times

It's different from the motor in my Concert 20, currently still undergoing repairs; here's a photo of that one, as well.

Both differ from the one in your photo. But then, I think no one ever accused Pathé of being consistent!