Looking for advice: Fair price for an Edison Standard with Model K reproducer?

[Aristophane]

Getting a 2/4 minute machine that has either a H or a C with it already and getting one or the other later can be a strategy instead of having a K. Using the C or the H also help you know which is in the machine. As other mentioned with the K you have remember how you left it set the last time it was used which usually means you pull it out to check first.....

I completely agree. This approach seems much safer to me. I hadn't thought about it that way before, but you're right: I wouldn't want to risk losing an early brown Pathé by accidentally subjecting it to a 4-minute reproducer.

[Aristophane]

You might also consider looking for an Edison Standard model B or Home model B that has been retrofitted with 2/4 gearing. The B models had an end gate, not the open-mandrel design that involves that pesky pot metal bearing. Also, the Standard B, at least, is extremely common, which should keep the price down. Personally, I would prefer a Model O reproducer--preferably with the trimmed-down, trowel-shaped weight--to a K, just because it's easier to switch between 2 and 4 and harder to get mixed up and pick the wrong one. That, of course, will mean a horizontal carrier eye and probably a cygnet horn, which may get pricey, but at least that's the setup I have (Triumph B, trowel-weight O, cygnet horn), and it's served me well.

How do you size up the audio performance of Edison vs. Pathé cylinder machines? I have very limited experience with the latter, which just don't turn up all that often in the U.S., but neither of the ones I've had (both low-end models) sounded anything like as good as any Edison of my acquaintance.

Thank you very much for those very helpful details. I’ve ultimately decided to pass on the Standard I saw on the US auction site, as I was specifically worried about that 'pot metal' mandrel bearing issue. The Triumph is a magnificent machine, but I’m quite short on space, so I will likely focus on finding a Standard B with the 2/4 gearing or a Fireside model A.

Regarding audio performance, my experience aligns with yours. Although I haven't tested the entire Pathé range (still looking for a Celeste! ), the difference is striking. Pathé models with a floating horn (without the 'Vérité' system) often produce a thin and shallow sound; I find that the weight of the horn directly on the wax compromises acoustic stability. While supported-horn models (using a crane or tone-arm) offer better clarity and depth, I find that Edison reproducers maintain a dynamic range and fidelity far superior to basic French machines. That said, my opinion remains subjective given the vast diversity of European reproducers and models. However, moving from a Pathé No. 0, 1, or 2 to an Edison makes the difference in quality immediately apparent.

[drh]

Best of luck in your search! One other thought: if space is an issue, a cygnet horn definitely should be up for consideration. The little 14-inch (or whatever) horns just don't sound that good, but something like a morning glory horn sticking out into the room on a crane or stand is remarkably awkward in a small space, or even in a congested large one. The cygnets, like the large conventional horns, sound good but, being vertical, actually don't take up much space in the room.

I had a Pathé 0 for a while; it was quite an odd little machine, with a motor design that turned the mandrel backwards. Not really a practical player. I currently have a Pathé 1, which plays better but not what I'd call exactly "well." It's a nice display piece, though, with the cool-looking Systeme Verite horn suspension, and I even found a mascot to go with it. (Photo below; lid not shown.) I think Pathé really came into its own when it shifted to discs.

[Valecnik]

Getting a 2/4 minute machine that has either a H or a C with it already and getting one or the other later can be a strategy instead of having a K. Using the C or the H also help you know which is in the machine. As other mentioned with the K you have remember how you left it set the last time it was used which usually means you pull it out to check first.....

I would prefer the idea of a machine, (even a Fireside) with an H and C reproducer too. The H and C have less issues with compliance on slightly out of round records than does the K. Something with an O is even much better yet. A large carriage machine including an O and a Diamond B and maybe a cygnet would be perfect for you but that of course means more money. Since you are in France you might want to checkout the European facebook group if you have not. The link is below. Also, there will be a show in Rüdesheim coming up in April. I'm sure you would have a lot of fun there! Good luck in your search! https://www.facebook.com/groups/317832355768488

[JerryVan]

I think you're beginning to see that there's no "right" answer. All of these machines are very old by now, and they all have their respective pros & cons. The only right answer is the one that satisfies your likes and your budget. Afterall, you're not purchasing this for any of us, (are you? ), so buy what looks the best to you and expect that with any mechanical thing that's 120 years old, it may need some attention.

[drh]

...expect that with any mechanical thing that's 120 years old, it may will need some attention.

Fixed that for you!

[Aristophane]

Best of luck in your search! One other thought: if space is an issue, a cygnet horn definitely should be up for consideration. The little 14-inch (or whatever) horns just don't sound that good, but something like a morning glory horn sticking out into the room on a crane or stand is remarkably awkward in a small space, or even in a congested large one. The cygnets, like the large conventional horns, sound good but, being vertical, actually don't take up much space in the room.

I had a Pathé 0 for a while; it was quite an odd little machine, with a motor design that turned the mandrel backwards. Not really a practical player. I currently have a Pathé 1, which plays better but not what I'd call exactly "well." It's a nice display piece, though, with the cool-looking Systeme Verite horn suspension, and I even found a mascot to go with it. (Photo below; lid not shown.) I think Pathé really came into its own when it shifted to discs.

"The cygnets, like the large conventional horns, sound good but, being vertical, actually don't take up much space in the room", I think it's time you talked to my wife!
I liked the little Pathé 0, but it's true that I avoided giving it standard or Inter quality cylinders for fear that it would ruin them.
Today I found an Edison Model F with an O reproducer I think, but I don't know how good it is in terms of quality. Apparently, they weren't on the market for very long.

[JerryVan]

Today I found an Edison Model F with an O reproducer I think, but I don't know how good it is in terms of quality. Apparently, they weren't on the market for very long.

Because, by the time the Model F came about, almost nobody was buying Edion cylinder machines anymore. Quality was not the issue.

[Aristophane]

I think you're beginning to see that there's no "right" answer. All of these machines are very old by now, and they all have their respective pros & cons. The only right answer is the one that satisfies your likes and your budget. Afterall, you're not purchasing this for any of us, (are you? ), so buy what looks the best to you and expect that with any mechanical thing that's 120 years old, it may need some attention.

You are absolutely right: at the end of the day, I am the one who will be listening to it! But while I am buying this for myself, the advice I receive here is invaluable for steering me in the right direction.
It’s a bit like if you told me you wanted to buy a Pathé n°4 specifically to play a Phénix cylinder—I would simply have to tell you that it's not a very good idea!
These 120-year-old machines certainly have their quirks, and I’m prepared to give them the attention they need. Having the right technical starting point just makes the journey that much more enjoyable.
Thanks again for your insights!

[Aristophane]

Today I found an Edison Model F with an O reproducer I think, but I don't know how good it is in terms of quality. Apparently, they weren't on the market for very long.

Because, by the time the Model F came about, almost nobody was buying Edion cylinder machines anymore. Quality was not the issue.

So the F with an O could be a good choice.